YTSEJAM Digest 6715 Today's Topics: 1) RE: more snippage... by "Ilia" 2) Re: Favorite DT albums by "Dave Schott" 3) snare sound on st. anger by Sebastian Keil 4) RE: Bad 80's hair metal by "Alexis Ramos" 5) Re: snare sound on st. anger by "Dave Schott" 6) Re: more snippage... by Mike Shetzer 7) Re: more snippage... by WB Henderson 8) Re: YTSEJAM digest 6714 by "Simon Dodd" 9) Re: snare sound on st. anger by Dave Peterson 10) Re: Favorite DT albums by email_address_removed 11) Re: more snippage... by Mike Shetzer 12) by "Alexandro Talamini" 13) Jordan by "Alexandro Talamini" 14) UK by WB Henderson ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 00:41:39 -0500 From: "Ilia" To: Subject: RE: more snippage... Message-ID: >Wow it was a joke. I'd ask Santa for a sense of humor if I were you. Wow... he really is an ass ;) >Anyone who feels like being blown away by some of the most nonsensical >complex instrumental prog metal EVER, check out their third release Moonbabies It makes sense, it's just damn near impossible to count. Derek made his intention very clear: create the sickest instrumental band in the world. He pretty much got what he asked for. I wish a lot of it was heavier, but I do enjoy listening to it, very UK influenced. Speaking of PX, anyone know what that song is called that's in C minor, goes between C Eb F G chords with different variations of time in between each, with a snare hit on each chord and constant hi-hat underneath? They did it on the Moonbabies tour, and Virgil did it at his PASIC clinic, but I can't find it on any of their albums. >somehow you don't think UAGM and the Voices >solo aren't insanely fast too ;) The main difference is, solos like ToT the song, UaGM (especially), and Voices are meticulously composed. Solos on TOT the album, and quite a few on 6DoiT, are improvised in a certain idiom. As someone aptly noted, Petrucci doesn't make habit of wasting notes - it's not "mindless" shredding. >The problem I have with that song (which is my favorite on the disc and I >guess coming from me isn't a huge ringing endorsement) is the spot at around >8 minutes that sounds exactly like the end of "Home". I'll note that a lot of Home sounds exactly like Metropolis Pt. I - it's all intentional. Speaking of like-sounding parts, does anyone think that one of the main riffs for Honor Thy Father sound like the main riff in Crimson Sunrise? I'm surprised no one has mentioned that yet. >Not saying the songs are bad 80's hair metal. >But they _sound like_ bad 80's hair metal. Well, it _was_ produced in the 80s and they _were_ only about 20-21 back then (except Charlie). Plus, if you watch some early Majesty videos, they were all about the hair metal - not so much the sound, but certainly the look. And, as has been mentioned just recently, Kevin is big on "soundscapes"... so the ambience had a lot of 80s soundscapes. The only tracks I skip on that CD are Status Seeker and OaMoT, however - the rest of the songs sound great to me. Of course, bad 80s hair metal used to be one of my favorite things to listen to, so I'm biased. Ok, ok, I'll shut up now.... sheesh :) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 02:09:33 -0500 From: "Dave Schott" To: Subject: Re: Favorite DT albums Message-ID: <00bf01c3affe$6a8ec000$0200a8c0@Two> This is very hard... 1. SFAM 2. I&W 2. Awake 4. ACoS 5. 6DoIT 6. ToT 7. FII 8. WDADU This addresses ACoS the song, not the album, I could never really dig the live parts... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Hayden" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 11:23 PM Subject: Re: Favorite DT albums > For what it's worth, my ranking is more or less identical to Brian's. The > top three spots are variable based on mood, but yeah... > > > Another album ranking: > > 1. Awake > > 2. I&W > > 3. ACoS > > 4. WDADU > > 5. FII > > 6. SFAM > > 7. 6DOIT > > > > Brian > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:56:34 +0100 From: Sebastian Keil To: Subject: snare sound on st. anger Message-ID: I just read an interview where Lars said the sound was an accident. For one demo recording seesion he forget the carpet under the snare. They listened to it, thought it was cool and left it at that. sab ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:20:51 -0400 From: "Alexis Ramos" To: Subject: RE: Bad 80's hair metal Message-ID: > > Oh, so you are saying songs like The Killing Hand, > TOWHTSTS, YtseJam, A Fortune In Lie is bad 80's hair > > metal?? I think yer on some bad 80's CRACK. > > Not saying the songs are bad 80's hair metal. But they > _sound like_ bad > 80's hair metal. What about Light Fuse And Get Away, > Afterlife, Only A > Matter Of Time, and my favourite of all, Status Seeker? > > If DT hadn't gone on to greater things, this album would be right up > there with "Shark Sandwich". > > T > > PS The Killing Hand and A Fortune In Lies are good - I still can't > listen to them as it's a joke to put a DT album in the player for two > songs. Oh please!!!!! How can you say you don't like OAMOT, LFAGA and Afterlife? OAMOT is one of my favorite DT songs ever, and one of the most inspiring songs I've ever heard. The only song on that album which I think is sub-par is Status Seeker. And Charlie's wimpy scream in The Killing Hand kills the studio version for me, although the live versions with James are amazing. As for the ranking of DT's albums, I don't think I can rank them right now. I like them all a lot, including FII (everybody who doesn't like this album should give it another chance), and my preferences vary with time. As for TOT, I'm still enjoying it quite a bit, although I do see some limitations in it that I'm pretty sure will limit its potential to become a classic. But it's still a very good album, although it pales in comparison when you compare it to another recent heavy prog album, Symphony X's The Odyssey. I've been listening to that album a lot lately, and I think it has the perfect combina! tion of heaviness and prog, along with incredible songwriting and musicianship. A masterpiece. Alexis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 08:55:34 -0500 From: "Dave Schott" To: Subject: Re: snare sound on st. anger Message-ID: <012001c3b037$22fe8020$0200a8c0@Two> > I just read an interview where Lars said the sound was an accident. For one > demo recording seesion he forget the carpet under the snare. They listened > to it, thought it was cool and left it at that. Generally I though SHIT was warm... not cool... -Dave Schott (AdmiralDave) email_address_removed http://www.bangarangband.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:31:56 -0500 From: Mike Shetzer To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: more snippage... Message-ID: <001d01c3b03c$37686260$9b00a8c0@mizz> --Boundary_(ID_DGf6NhrvwDOtz16lhGeQCw) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT >It makes sense, it's just damn near impossible to count. Derek made his >intention very clear: create the sickest instrumental band in the world. He >pretty much got what he asked for. I wish a lot of it was heavier, but I do >enjoy listening to it, very UK influenced. Speaking of PX, anyone know what >that song is called that's in C minor, goes between C Eb F G chords with >different variations of time in between each, with a snare hit on each chord >and constant hi-hat underneath? They did it on the Moonbabies tour, and >Virgil did it at his PASIC clinic, but I can't find it on any of their >albums. I never tried to figure out PX songs ;) Heavier? Come on, some of this shit is pretty heavy. Universe is extremely heavy, but I find lacks the composition value of Moonbabies. Self titled Planet X is less heavy Moonbabies but is more melodic and less weirdly rhythmic and melodically complex. UK influenced? Please tell me which bands UK style remind you of Planet X, cuz I'm interested to find ANYONE that can do stuff similar to them!!!! --Boundary_(ID_DGf6NhrvwDOtz16lhGeQCw) ---YTSEJAM FILTER: Rest of message skipped because of attachment ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:42:13 -0500 From: WB Henderson To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: more snippage... Message-ID: Mike Shetzer wrote: >Please tell me which bands UK style remind you of Planet X, cuz I'm >interested to find ANYONE that can do stuff similar to them!!!! I think he meant the band UK. And they are similar at times. (Although I prefer UK.) Brian ============================================= WB Henderson email_address_removed ============================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:43:15 -0000 From: "Simon Dodd" To: Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 6714 Message-ID: <000601c3b046$2dc32970$message_id_removed.uk> > From: Antony Gelberg > Subject: Re: Favorite DT albums > > On Thu, Nov 20, 2003 at 02:35:38PM -0800, Simon Dodd wrote: > > Mine would run: > > > > 1) I&W > > =2) FII > > =2) Awake > > 3) ACoS > > 4) 6 Degrees > > 5) WD&DU > > 6) Scenes > > > > TOT will be somewhere below 6 Degrees. > > > > ~sjd > > That's two people who put WDADU above ACOS and SFAM respectively. I > know it's subjective and all, but WDADU just sounds like an appaling > 80's hair metal record with technical playing. Well, that's probably at least partially true. It's reheated, Rush-esque techno hair metal. It's not great, and although there are some gerat somgs on there (Afterlife, OAMOT, Ytsejam, TKH, AFIL), only two (OAMOT and Ytsejam) have really survived the test of time, and sound credible being played these days. The relative positions of WD&DU and SFaM has less to do with the merits of the former, and more to do with the demerits of the latter. My immediate disappointment with Scenes when I heard it in 1999, having rushed out to the stores expecting so much after FII and the Liquid Tension records, and all the talking of a classic DT album, has matured into a fairly persistant distaste for that album. In all, the best I can say about it without qualification is that Finally Free and One Last Time are both lovely pieces. Every other compliment requires a qualifier - the intro to Home is great, but is a shameless rip from Tool; TSCO is great in a "not so much copied as photocopied from The Wall" kind of way. I really think Scenes is their worst record by a huge margin. ---YTSEJAM-FILTER: This message was posted using the YML command ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 11:03:58 -0800 (PST) From: Dave Peterson To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: snare sound on st. anger Message-ID: I work at a recording studio and lemme tell ya. Rarely do people put carpets under snares. That snare sound has nothing to do with whether or not a carpet was there and everthing to do with a drummer who can't tune a snare and an engineer that tried to be adventurous and turn it way up in the mix. While I admire adventurism, this was a case of them hearing a shitty sound and thinking it's not. "Your drumming sounds odd (shitty), Lars" "It's not odd (shitty), it's cool" That's what all the shitty drummers say, anyway. ;) - Dave --- Dave Schott wrote: > > I just read an interview where Lars said the sound was an accident. For > one > > demo recording seesion he forget the carpet under the snare. They listened > > to it, thought it was cool and left it at that. > > Generally I though SHIT was warm... not cool... > > -Dave Schott (AdmiralDave) > email_address_removed > http://www.bangarangband.com > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 14:40:09 EST From: email_address_removed To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Favorite DT albums Message-ID: On 20/11/2003 at 08:42:01 +0100, wrote : > OK I know it's almost impossible to put some DT albums in > front of others but give it a try [...] I'm just interested in seeing > your order of favorite albums (Old and new ytsejammers euuhhh > fogies). Heh... :-) Well, I kinda qualify under both categories : I've been on and off this list an awful lot since 1997, but until now I've never felt moved to post - by the time I got around to it, someone else had always said what I wanted to anyhow! Anyway, so here's the thoughts of a veteran newbie, or newbie veteran, or whatever... ;-) > I don't think we should include TOT yet until at least 6 months, > otherwise I know I can't have the retrospect. That's fair comment if you ask me... I know I'm really enjoying ToT at the moment, but who knows how I'll feel about it a year from now? Albums either fade, or improve, slowly with age - at least, to these ears they tend to... Anyway, if I was forced to rate the studio discs against each other, you'd get (in descending order) : [1] Scenes From A Memory Still my favourite... I'm still amazed that some folks dislike it so intensely. Sure, I can believe that it's not everyone's favourite, but likewise I find it hard to credit that for some folks, it's DT at their worst. Still, each to their own, etc... ;-) [2] Awake My first DT album, and still a firm favourite. [3] Six Degrees... Based almost entirely on Disc 1, which is fabulous from start to finish. Disc 2 I really have to be in the mood for, and even now "Overture" makes me cringe! [4] Images And Words Solid stuff - not much else I can add to what everyone else has said about this one over the years! [5] Falling Into Infinity Flawed, but still excellent. "Trial Of Tears" is remembered so fondly for a reason! "New Millennium", "Peruvian Skies", "Lines In The Sand" and "You Not Me" are all firm favourites, too. [6] A Change Of Seasons The title suite is awesome, but I can hardly bear to hear this studio version now, after hearing the live version on "Live Scenes..." which just *slays* this avergaely-produced studio version. The live stuff is solid, but I can take or leave it - I'm not fond of covers on the whole, even though their take on "Perfect Strangers" is wonderful... :-) [7] When Dream And Day Unite Great material, on the whole (yes, even "Afterlife", which is bloody good fun), spoilt by piss-poor production. Hopefully one day the band will get their wish and be able to remix/re-record the album into a form they're happy with... :-) > So, from my point of view, the years have not tired them... Same here : there's not many bands I could say have been as consistently entertaining throughout their career. And nothing's changed, based on ToT. It seems to me that every album they've ever released is someone's favourite and someone's least favourite, which just goes to show... ;-) Back to lurkerdom, then... Peace, HippyDave NP: "Seasons End" (Marillion) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 14:43:02 -0500 From: Mike Shetzer To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: more snippage... Message-ID: <001b01c3b067$ad08a1d0$9b00a8c0@mizz> --Boundary_(ID_OwFMW1d+YZB0sKcmKF+J8Q) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Oh :) Can't say I've ever heard of them, what's their story? ----- Original Message ----- From: WB Henderson To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 10:51 AM Subject: Re: more snippage... Mike Shetzer wrote: >Please tell me which bands UK style remind you of Planet X, cuz I'm >interested to find ANYONE that can do stuff similar to them!!!! I think he meant the band UK. And they are similar at times. (Although I prefer UK.) Brian ============================================ WB Henderson email_address_removed ============================================ --Boundary_(ID_OwFMW1d+YZB0sKcmKF+J8Q) ---YTSEJAM FILTER: Rest of message skipped because of attachment ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 19:44:02 -0200 From: "Alexandro Talamini" To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Message-ID: Well, you have mine too. =) Oh, I would include "Solitary Shell" along with Misunderstood. I haven't heard ToT yet because it's not yet released here in Brazil, but reading the digests lately makes me wonder why the band recruted Jordan. As far as I know because of their great work and chemistry in the LTE projects, where he is wonderful playing/composing that kind of music. I think the same applies to him in SFaM. To me, the "heavier" direction taken on 6DoIT and on ToT (apparently) places him in a support role wasting his real talent. I wouldn't be surprised if in a near future he leaves the band as Kevin did in the past. Alex > >Absolutely... personally, I would rather they just > >released Blind Faith as a single with Misunderstood >as a >B side than the 6DOIT album ;P I'm sure > >that'll make me popular on the list :P > >well, you have my vote :) > _________________________________________________________________ MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. http://messenger.msn.com.br ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 19:44:10 -0200 From: "Alexandro Talamini" To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Jordan Message-ID: Well, you have mine too. =) Oh, I would include "Solitary Shell" along with Misunderstood. I haven't heard ToT yet because it's not yet released here in Brazil, but reading the digests lately makes me wonder why the band recruted Jordan. As far as I know because of their great work and chemistry in the LTE projects, where he is wonderful playing/composing that kind of music. I think the same applies to him in SFaM. To me, the "heavier" direction taken on 6DoIT and on ToT (apparently) places him in a support role wasting his real talent. I wouldn't be surprised if in a near future he leaves the band as Kevin did in the past. Alex > >Absolutely... personally, I would rather they just > >released Blind Faith as a single with Misunderstood >as a >B side than the 6DOIT album ;P I'm sure > >that'll make me popular on the list :P > >well, you have my vote :) > _________________________________________________________________ MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. http://messenger.msn.com.br ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 17:35:05 -0500 From: WB Henderson To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: UK Message-ID: Mike Shetzer wrote: >Can't say I've ever heard of them, what's their story? UK's one of the best prog supergroups of all time. The line-up... Allan Holdsworth - guitar (only on first album) Eddie Jobson - keys/violin John Wetton - bass/vox Bill Bruford - drums Terry Bozzio - drums (replaced Bruford after first album) If you're a Planet-X and/or King Crimson fan, you're almost guaranteed to like 'em. They've only got a few albums - try the first, self-titled, disc for starters. Brian [NP...Ephel Duath - The Painter's Palette (note: my thanks to whoever it was that recommended this band a few months back)] ============================================= WB Henderson email_address_removed ============================================= ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 6715 ************************** === Contributions to ytsejam: ytsejam@torchsong.com === === Send requests to: ytsejam-request@torchsong.com === === More information at: http://www.dreamt.org/local/ytsejam.php === === Brought by the ghost of ytsejam@arastar.coms past === === Reach the owner of this list at: ytsejam-owner@torchsong.com ===