YTSEJAM Digest 5987 Today's Topics: 1) Re: Brazil and lack of respect by Brian Hansen 2) Re: Brazil and lack of respect by "Rob Pociluk" 3) Re: Brazil and lack of respect by Lisa Palma 4) Before you make a comment... by Chris Elder 5) Re: Before you make a comment... by email_address_removed 6) rob pociluk, you are the first ... by julio fucinos 7) DT in Rolling Stone by Michael & Pamela Nazer 8) RE: Brazil and lack of respect by "Nick Bogovich" 9) The future looks bright by "Souter, Jan-Michael" 10) Re: The future looks bright by "Carlos A. Alfaro" 11) RE: The future looks bright by "Souter, Jan-Michael" 12) Re: The future looks bright by Michael & Pamela Nazer 13) Re: The future looks bright by "Carlos A. Alfaro" 14) Re: The future looks bright by "Dr. Mosh" 15) Re: The future looks bright by Eric George 16) Re: The future looks bright by "Carlos A. Alfaro" 17) Re: The future looks bright by "Carlos A. Alfaro" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 13:34:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Hansen To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Brazil and lack of respect Message-ID: "Paul W. Cashman" wrote: > If someone had flown two airliners into skyscrapers in Rio de Janeiro, > with coverage all over CNN, the U.S. and the world had outpoured > help and assistance (as we would have), and an artist from, say, > Sweden then paid tribute to Brazil on a U.S. stage, I can't imagine an > American audience responding in the same way. I agree with Paul. America would be offering aid, sending rescue crews, money, food, clothes, etc. And I can't imagine a crowd booing if Yngwie got up and played someone else's national anthem. As long as it has a good melody. ;o) "Rob Pociluk" wrote: > When was the last time Americans supported a country when it wasn't in OUR interests? > Please don't try preaching to me on this one. We trained Bin Laden!!! > How can you not say this is OUR problem that WE created? Who are you calling "Americans"? That's a pretty broad category. Are you an "American"? Are you guilty of all these crimes you accuse "America" of? That's about as ignorant as calling all of the Islamic countries "terrorists". Most of the Americans I know do NOT support many of the stupid things that the government might do. As for Bin Laden, I take it that your opinion is that no one is responsible for their own actions? Whine somewhere else. The person who is DOING the terrorism is the guilty party. Or maybe we should blame Osama Bin Laden's mommy for not giving him enough love. If a Policeman loses his mind and starts murdering people, is it the Police Department's fault for training him? Give me a break! "Maarten Braakhekke" wrote: > I myself am from the Netherlands and I think the general > response to the attacks in my country and also in the rest > of the world was VERY hypocrital. Terrible stuff like this, > and worse, is happening every day and has been happening for > decades if not centuries all over the world. Well, if you're talking about the News media, forget about about any even or fair reporting there. It's all self-serving propaganda. Of course they make a big deal about New York. It's the home of the American media, and closely related to the International media. They don't talk about far away and remote places because they are FAR AWAY AND REMOTE (from the people who produce the crap you see on tv). If the international NEWS media was based in Kabul, you'd be hearing a lot more about Afgahnistan. Pretty simple stuff here... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? NEW from Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 18:35:58 -0400 From: "Rob Pociluk" To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Brazil and lack of respect Message-ID: Typical testosterone. Whatever. You're more American than me. Obviously. Point missed. No surprise. Later. ---- Begin Original Message ---- From: Brian Hansen Sent: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 13:44:56 -0700 (PDT) To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Brazil and lack of respect "Paul W. Cashman" wrote: > If someone had flown two airliners into skyscrapers in Rio de Janeiro, > with coverage all over CNN, the U.S. and the world had outpoured > help and assistance (as we would have), and an artist from, say, > Sweden then paid tribute to Brazil on a U.S. stage, I can't imagine an > American audience responding in the same way. I agree with Paul. America would be offering aid, sending rescue crews, money, food, clothes, etc. And I can't imagine a crowd booing if Yngwie got up and played someone else's national anthem. As long as it has a good melody. ;o) "Rob Pociluk" wrote: > When was the last time Americans supported a country when it wasn't in OUR interests? > Please don't try preaching to me on this one. We trained Bin Laden!!! > How can you not say this is OUR problem that WE created? Who are you calling "Americans"? That's a pretty broad category. Are you an "American"? Are you guilty of all these crimes you accuse "America" of? That's about as ignorant as calling all of the Islamic countries "terrorists". Most of the Americans I know do NOT support many of the stupid things that the government might do. As for Bin Laden, I take it that your opinion is that no one is responsible for their own actions? Whine somewhere else. The person who is DOING the terrorism is the guilty party. Or maybe we should blame Osama Bin Laden's mommy for not giving him enough love. If a Policeman loses his mind and starts murdering people, is it the Police Department's fault for training him? Give me a break! "Maarten Braakhekke" wrote: > I myself am from the Netherlands and I think the general > response to the attacks in my country and also in the rest > of the world was VERY hypocrital. Terrible stuff like this, > and worse, is happening every day and has been happening for > decades if not centuries all over the world. Well, if you're talking about the News media, forget about about any even or fair reporting there. It's all self-serving propaganda. Of course they make a big deal about New York. It's the home of the American media, and closely related to the International media. They don't talk about far away and remote places because they are FAR AWAY AND REMOTE (from the people who produce the crap you see on tv). If the international NEWS media was based in Kabul, you'd be hearing a lot more about Afgahnistan. Pretty simple stuff here... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? NEW from Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ---- End Original Message ---- Dream Theater : The Official Site - http://www.dreamtheater.net/ ____________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE Web and POP E-mail Service in 14 languages at http://www.zzn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 15:59:53 -0700 From: Lisa Palma To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Brazil and lack of respect Message-ID: At 03:40 PM 10/8/2001, "Rob Pociluk" wrote: >Typical testosterone. Whatever. You're more American than >me. Obviously. Point missed. No surprise. Later. Weren't you going to shut your yap a couple of posts ago? I can find your post and quote it for you if you've forgotten. ~L ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 23:39:56 -0600 From: Chris Elder To: Subject: Before you make a comment... Message-ID: Know what you are talking about... > When was the last time Americans > supported a country when it wasn't in OUR interests? Not to start anything here, but since there is a lack of music related posts, what the hell. I feel the need to defend my country. RP Read this, it might clear up your confused mind, along with anyone that is confused about our/ MY great country, ahem... Maarten: TRIBUTE TO THE UNITED STATES This, from a Canadian Newspaper, is worth sharing. America: The Good Neighbor. Widespread but only partial news coverage was given recently to a remarkable editorial broadcast from Toronto by Gordon Sinclair, a Canadian television Commentator. What follows is the full text of his trenchant remarks as printed in the Congressional Record: "This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth. Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out of the debris of war by the AMericans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States. When France was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it. When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries in to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by tornadoes. Nobody helped. The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent, warmongering Americans. I'd like to see just one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplane. Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas DC-10? If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the international lines except Russia fly American Planes? Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on the moon? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy, and you get automobiles. You talk about American technocracy, and you find men on the moon -not once, but several times - and safely home again. You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everybody to look at. Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at home to spend here. When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them and old caboose. Both are still broke. I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake. Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them get kicked around. They will come oout of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of those. Stand proud, America! Wear it proudly!!" and... >Terrible stuff like this, and worse, is happening every day and has been >happening for decades if not centuries all over the world. So it is common for other countries to lose billion dollar monuments, and hundreds of billions more in the economy, lost companies and the like. Not to mention 6,000 innocent people murdered. Not likely. You are comparing grapes to watermelons. This message reminds me of some video footage of Afghanis celebrating the day of the attacks, passing out M&Ms to the kids, meanwhile there is a Pepsi machine clear as day in the background. Now who are the hypocrites? - chris Every dominating sports team knows: when you're on top, everybody wants a piece of you. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 00:08:47 EDT From: email_address_removed To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: Before you make a comment... Message-ID: --part1_ce.1b87e1d8.28f3d24f_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" In a message dated 10/8/2001 11:54:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, email_address_removed writes: >< >Terrible stuff like this, and worse, is happening every day and has been >happening for decades if not centuries all over the world. So it is common for other countries to lose billion dollar monuments, and hundreds of billions more in the economy, lost companies and the like.=A0 No t to mention 6,000 innocent people murdered.=A0 Not likely.=A0 You are compari ng grapes to watermelons. >< Us Americans have certainly been ignorant to the dozens upon dozens of terrorists attacks that have happened all over the world and had no effect o n us, but it is safe to say that none of them were as big in scale as this. No buildings this size, no death toll this large, and no economic loss this big has ever been seen in the history of terrorism. Don't take that statement th e wrong way, though, because I'm certainly not saying that previous terroist attacks were less tragic just because less people died. Still in all, I can't help but bring up the fact that America is responsible for possibly the largest mass murder in history. I don't know the death toll of the holocaust, so I can't say Hiroshima and Nagasaki *definitely* killed more people - and that was war, this is terrorism - but the point is, we've been guilty of some heinous things in the past. I'm just thankful that our present government hasn't reacted the way the Truman administration did, or we might be dropping nukes on the entire middle East right about now. - jim --part1_ce.1b87e1d8.28f3d24f_boundary ---YTSEJAM FILTER: Rest of message skipped because of attachment ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 07:51:54 +0200 (CEST) From: julio fucinos To: ytsejam Subject: rob pociluk, you are the first ... Message-ID: hi there ... after reading the last ytsejam's issues and millions of posts to dt.net, i've realized that american people are more blind that i could never imagine ... but something happen some minutes ago, when i read rp's post on the jam ... > When was the last time Americans supported a country > when it wasn't in OUR interests? hummm, just remember somalia, rwanda, the balcans, chechnia ... where was the uncle sam there? of course i am not saying that the us should act as the "world police" (us SHOULDN'T ...) but it seems that many of the american people who write to ytsejam and dt.net believe they are the "world police" ... if you want to read a very interesting post on this, you should try one post at dt.net's mb, signed by "tiago" (a brazilian guy), where he exposes very clearly what brazilian felt when they listened to yngwie (sp?) play the us national anthem again and again ... c u _______________________________________________________________ Nokia Game ha comenzado Haz clic y disfruta de la nueva aventura multimedia de Nokia antes del 3 de noviembre. http://es.promotions.yahoo.com/info/nokiagame.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 06:42:14 -0500 From: Michael & Pamela Nazer To: ytsejam Subject: DT in Rolling Stone Message-ID: In the oct.25th issue of Rolling Stone there is a brief mention of DT and a picture of the cover art.(pg 34 and 38). Pam ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 08:17:43 -0400 From: "Nick Bogovich" To: Subject: RE: Brazil and lack of respect Message-ID: If the police department trains him to become this mass murderer, then it is absolutely the police department's fault for training him. -bogie -----Original Message----- From: Brian Hansen [mailto:email_address_removed Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 4:45 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Brazil and lack of respect If a Policeman loses his mind and starts murdering people, is it the Police Department's fault for training him? Give me a break! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 12:37:17 -0500 From: "Souter, Jan-Michael" To: "'ytsejam@torchsong.com'" Subject: The future looks bright Message-ID: <74ACE5A6CB89D3119E6F00609720274A06BA2536@ISDCRE00> New York - Year 2032 > > > > A father and his son are walking the Manhattan streets > > when the father stops at a vacant lot takes a deep > > breath and tells his son: To think that at one time > > here on this very lot stood the Twin Towers. > > > The son looks at his father and asked: Dad, what are > > the Twin Towers? > > > > Father says: My dear son, the Twin Towers were two > > tremendously tall buildings with lots of offices that > > was the heart of the United States, but approx. 31 > years ago, several Arabs destroyed the buildings. > > > > The boy then thought for a minute and then asked his > > father: Daddy what are Arabs? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 13:55:01 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro" To: Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: <000701c150eb$8522edc0$39351ec8@atenas> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Souter, Jan-Michael" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 1:43 PM Subject: The future looks bright > New York - Year 2032 Kind of distasteful, IMO. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 13:19:50 -0500 From: "Souter, Jan-Michael" To: "'ytsejam@torchsong.com'" Subject: RE: The future looks bright Message-ID: <74ACE5A6CB89D3119E6F00609720274A06BA253F@ISDCRE00> As was the attack in New York. Time for that kind of activity all over the world to end. > -----Original Message----- > From: Carlos A. Alfaro [SMTP:email_address_removed > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 1:10 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Re: The future looks bright > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Souter, Jan-Michael" > To: "Multiple recipients of list" > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 1:43 PM > Subject: The future looks bright > > > > New York - Year 2032 > > Kind of distasteful, IMO. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 13:26:04 -0500 From: Michael & Pamela Nazer To: Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: I find this very offensive. I will not condemn the Arab people. These acts were most likely done by Islamic extremists. Blaming all Arabs would be like blaming all Christian people for the actions of the kkk. Peace, Pam on 10/9/01 12:43 PM, Souter, Jan-Michael at email_address_removed wrote: > New York - Year 2032 >>> >>> A father and his son are walking the Manhattan streets > > when the > father stops at a vacant lot takes a deep > > breath and tells his son: To > think that at one time > > here on this very lot stood the Twin Towers. >>> >> The son looks at his father and asked: Dad, what are > > the Twin Towers? >>> >>> Father says: My dear son, the Twin Towers were two > > tremendously tall > buildings with lots of offices that > > was the heart of the United States, > but approx. 31 > years ago, several Arabs destroyed the buildings. >>> >>> The boy then thought for a minute and then asked his > > father: Daddy > what are Arabs? > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 14:44:50 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro" To: Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: <000901c150f2$7bf29e10$39351ec8@atenas> > As was the attack in New York. > > Time for that kind of activity all over the world to end. > Right, all arabs need to be exterminated to a point that 31 years from now kids wont know they didnt even exist. THAT will solve all the terrorist problems in the world right? sheesh... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 12:04:35 -0700 From: "Dr. Mosh" To: ytsejam@torchsong.com Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: What's wrong with blaming "christians"?? The name of God has been used to kill more people and destroy more civilizations than any other name of the same. -The Doc Signal received 0. Michael & Pamela Nazer said: > I find this very offensive. I will not condemn the Arab people. These acts > were most likely done by Islamic extremists. Blaming all Arabs would be > like blaming all Christian people for the actions of the kkk. > > Peace, > > Pam > > > on 10/9/01 12:43 PM, Souter, Jan-Michael at email_address_removed wrote: > > > New York - Year 2032 > >>> > >>> A father and his son are walking the Manhattan streets > > when the > > father stops at a vacant lot takes a deep > > breath and tells his son: To > > think that at one time > > here on this very lot stood the Twin Towers. > >>> > >> The son looks at his father and asked: Dad, what are > > the Twin Towers? > >>> > >>> Father says: My dear son, the Twin Towers were two > > tremendously tall > > buildings with lots of offices that > > was the heart of the United States, > > but approx. 31 > years ago, several Arabs destroyed the buildings. > >>> > >>> The boy then thought for a minute and then asked his > > father: Daddy > > what are Arabs? > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 15:23:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric George To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Oct 2001, Michael & Pamela Nazer wrote: > I find this very offensive. I will not condemn the Arab people. These acts > were most likely done by Islamic extremists. Blaming all Arabs would be > like blaming all Christian people for the actions of the kkk. > extremely good point. just as the actions and beliefs of the kkk have absolutely nothing to do with christianity, the actions of the terrorists have nothing to do with true islam. on the radio the other day, there was an interview with the 4 head-religious figures of the islamic faith (don't know what they're officially called). anyhow, one of them was actually quoted as saying that if there is any kind of jihad (holy war) to be declared (since technically, they are the only one's that can officially declare jihad), that it should be declared against bin laden and his band for the lines that they have crossed & for what they are doing "in the name of islam". those that actually hold to what islam is really all about are disgusted with bin laden. excellent way, mr. souter, of promoting a stereotype that doesn't hold true (as most don't either). show a little more class, despite how you may want to vent whatever anger & frustration you seem to have. direct it at those that deserve it, not those who don't, & especially those that defend the one's that unjustly fall under your blanket stereotype. lovin' God, country, & my music, eric ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 15:34:24 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro" To: Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: <001b01c150f9$67000d60$39351ec8@atenas> > What's wrong with blaming "christians"?? The name of God has been used to kill > more people and destroy more civilizations than any other name of the same. > > -The Doc Yes but would you call for the annihilation of *all* people that are christian based on the actions of those who have used the name of God to do all those things? -Carlos ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2001 15:36:36 -0400 From: "Carlos A. Alfaro" To: Subject: Re: The future looks bright Message-ID: <003101c150f9$b5dcf4c0$39351ec8@atenas> > What's wrong with blaming "christians"?? The name of God has been used to kill > more people and destroy more civilizations than any other name of the same. > > -The Doc Furthermore, would you think then that all Americans are guilty and should be erradicated, because of the millions of people that the US gov. has killed as well? It makes no sense. ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 5987 ************************** === Contributions to ytsejam: ytsejam@torchsong.com === === Send requests to: ytsejam-request@torchsong.com === === Brought by the ghost of ytsejam@arastar.coms past === === Reach the owner of this list at: ytsejam-owner@torchsong.com ===