YTSEJAM Digest 4604

Today's Topics:

  1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4600
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
  2) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
  3) Hotmail bozo's
 by Graham Boyle <email_address_removed.au>
  4) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
  5) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
  6) maybe not
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
  7) Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
 by "Brian Hayden" <email_address_removed>
  8) Need info on TLA show
 by Jason Hartman <email_address_removed>
  9) D.C. Cooper
 by "Al @ Switchcraft" <email_address_removed>
 10) Petition
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
 11) Stickage
 by "Geoffrey Simmons" <email_address_removed>
 12) yet another...
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
 13) DT's collective wardrobe
 by email_address_removed
 14) Re: yet another...
 by "Brian Hayden" <email_address_removed>
 15) A man does rosey blooms.
 by "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
 16) LTE: 1/21/99 in NYC
 by email_address_removed
 17) D.C. Cooper
 by Joe DeAngelo <email_address_removed>
 18) re: guess what?
 by "Neil Evans" <email_address_removed>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 20:27:15 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4600
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>



>>>Oh, and one last thing.... to the flaming inferno guy from hotmail...
YOU HATE DEREK! WE _GET_ IT! So quit posting three times a 'jam to say
how much of a faggot he is or that sort of bullshit. Man, I haven't been
this irritated since the last Madsman/Bahr debates...<<<

Who is flaming inferno guy? I do notice some moron keeps calling Derek 
this or that all the time, and I'm sick of it too.

Let's all hate-mail the jerk.



Lars Hellsten gargled the algae he sucked out of his fishtank:


> AND ALSO, yes, I DO worry that the next DT will just be LTE III.> 
> I really hope DT doesn't fall apart because of this.>


>>>-maXShut up.
Shouldn't you get back to working on your proof that God exists?<<<

Ha ha. You can decide to keep your head in a little box all you want. 
What the Hell does that have to do with the sound of DT99???

-------

   NOW, I am curious where it says DT99 will be written/recorded like 
LTE. I don't see it in the website. I just remember it being quoted 
several times.


Anyway, back to my sun worshiping and bowing before the grass and slugs.


-maX

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 20:32:20 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>



Scott announced:


>>>You know...this brings up an interesting point. Why in the hell is DT 
still
playing PMU? I mean at every show it is played (with the exception ofthe
recent holiday shows), it is on I&W and live versions are on 5YIAL 
andLATM.
Personally, I hope they NEVER play this song again live. There is 
soooomuch
good DT material that never (or hardly ever) gets played.<<<


   I WANNA HEAR THE ONES WHO HELP TO SET THE SUN!!!

Oh well. I can Dream. <in the background "Pull Me Under!", then the 
sound of Scott "pulling him under" and kicking his ass>


-maX

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 15:35:21 +1100
From: Graham Boyle <email_address_removed.au>
To: "email_address_removed" <email_address_removed>, email_address_removed
Subject: Hotmail bozo's
Message-ID: <message_id_removed.au>


Anyone else out there had enough of  "maX Verran"
<email_address_removed>
foul mouth and abuse ?
If you, please do what I am doing, emailing the list moderator asking
him to be removed
from the list. email_address_removed or email_address_removed
I am sure that if he used a real email address his foul/rude  mouthed
emails would not
be tolerated by any ISP.

gaz

some examples of "maX Verran" <email_address_removed> are:
You stupid ass murfa.
Fuck off and get off our list.
You can shut the Fuck up too, dickmunch.
This is a Dream Theater fan list. And if anyone calles their music shit
here, I'm going to your house to rape your sister.

This was just skimmed off one digest, this guy does not deserve to be on
this list


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 20:41:12 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


>From: "Isaac Trumbo" <email_address_removed>
>Subject: i hope derek gets hit by a truck
>
>support!! ha!!!! support a rake up your ass you fucking bastard!! 
>
>>"it is true, I was replaced by Jordan Rudess.>
>>anyway i am ok, and working on my solo record
>>that will be out on magna carta in MAY.>
>>thank you for all of your support, and please stay in touch!!
>>your friend, Derek"


OK. The asshole's name is Isaac.


   This is a SERIOUS question to the jam. Does anybody think this jerk 
should NOT be removed from the list? I don't think anybody wants him 
here.

Skadz? Are you reading this? Please remove Isaac Trumbo.

It's not like I just don't like him. It's not a personal feeling (I say 
this so Isaac doesn't say "Well, I don't like maX. Or whoever. Remove 
him/them.) Nobody appreciates his comments, and all he can do is bash a 
(former) member of Dream Theater.

I think Isaac can join the Hanson mailing list. THEN he can bash Derek 
all he wants and nobody will care.


-maX

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 20:43:35 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


>Nikki/IceQD wrote

wrong.

>>I am not currently subscribed to the list.
>
>So how do you know about IceQD and her posts and our suspicions that
>you 2 are the same person ?

I told her.


-maX

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 20:52:23 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: maybe not
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>



Asshole calls again:

>>>kevin moore i support.. kevin moore was a vital part of dream 
theater.. 
jordan rudess i support.. i can see him adding wonderfully to the 
music.. derek sherinian is a bitch!! his open dislike for prog and his 
fruity ass affermation of shit like marylin manson is disgusting..<<<


Well, since I already know that NICKY LEMONS *JOKED* about hating prog 
and DT, I also wonder if Derek hates Marylin Manson too.

He probably doesn't like that mu'rfa at all.

--------

   Oh, by the way, jammers. Welcome to Page 46.



-maX

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 22:57:12 -0600
From: "Brian Hayden" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed, email_address_removed
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 4601
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>



> OK. The asshole's name is Isaac.
> 
> 
>    This is a SERIOUS question to the jam. Does anybody think this jerk 
> should NOT be removed from the list? I don't think anybody wants him 
> here.
> 
> Skadz? Are you reading this? Please remove Isaac Trumbo.
> 
> It's not like I just don't like him. It's not a personal feeling (I say 
> this so Isaac doesn't say "Well, I don't like maX. Or whoever. Remove 
> him/them.)

Pot. Kettle. Black.

Get on home, little man. 

-Brian



------------------------------

Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 00:01:15 -0500
From: Jason Hartman <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Need info on TLA show
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


Does anyone know anything about the LTE show Friday night at the TLA in
Philly?  What time do doors open?  Is there an opening act?  When will DT
hit the stage?  18+?  21+? etc.

Thanks for the info!

Jason Hartman

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 23:03:38 -0600
From: "Al @ Switchcraft" <email_address_removed>
To: retaehT maerD <email_address_removed>
Subject: D.C. Cooper
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


maX Verran wrote:
>  I think D.C. Cooper from AOI is one totally awesome singer. What band
>is he from?

Royal Hunt.  Great band, but don't expect heavy Prog-Metal.
I like them.


--
Al -  The Ytse-ProGtologist
                           ^
Switchcraft Microsystems
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It's supposed to pack an awesome buzz" --Butthead



------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:08:40 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: Petition
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


<< Now if we can only get them to go back to the old "Dream Theater" 
font for
the CD covers :)

>>Yes, yes!  Where do I sign the petition?


-maX officially signs the Dream Theater old album cover font petition.

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:53:43 -0700
From: "Geoffrey Simmons" <email_address_removed>
To: <email_address_removed>
Subject: Stickage
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


Not to stretch this out, but, um...

<< Umm...David, dosen't the Stick count when playing two-handed tapping? 
>>

<Not when you're talking about the bass.... :)

<Very similar, yet very different instruments....

Actually, Chapman makes a "Stick-Bass" :o)

-Geoffrey



------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:25:27 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: yet another...
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


>>>To me, Derek was excactly what DT needed more of. Let's face it, prog 
is
goofy nerd music and any influences apart from progressive rock are
necessary if anything worthwhile is to come out.<<<

Then you can always unsub from this list.


>>>DT is great because ofthe
variety of influences embraced, as the case with Zep and other 
greats.<<<

I see. Led Zepplin. That explains it.

>>>Derek added some rock'n'roll that I found made the end result that 
much better. No offense, but IMhighlysubjectiveO most of the neo prog 
metal bands I've forced myself to listen to, incl. Kamelot and Shadow 
Gallery, turned outto be crap.<<<

Queensryche? Fates Warning? Um... 


>>>In 91 DT was THE THING.<<<

IAW was '92. Carried over to '93. No '91.



-whO?

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 00:33:32 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed
To: email_address_removed
Subject: DT's collective wardrobe
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


> <<What she said was that IN MUSIC there's no call to judge somebody by
> how they dress.  At least not in rock music.  >>
> 
> Actually, clothing does carry some weight.  Ive read before (in some "how 
> to form a band" book) that it is suggested that the band establish a
> physical image that reflects their music.  For a death metal band to go
> on stage in tuxedos and short hair may add a certain strangeness to 
> their presence on stage, it really isnt what is going to happen.  In
> Derek's case, the rest of the band was in t shirts and jeans, and he was
> in see-through shirts and leather pants.  Didnt quite fit.
> 
> Matt

Wait a minute.  I agree that clothing is important in a band.  A band
needs a unified "look."  However, let's take a look at Dream Theater's
various tours and wardrobes worn thereupon (and I'm exclding Mike Portnoy 
because he wears the same thing every time anyway):

Images and Words tour:  the first time I saw them, the look was BLACK.
Wear any color you want as long as it's black. :)  JP wore black jeans and
a black silk shirt.  JL wore black leather pants, a black leather vest, a
black leather jacket (think TTT video) and a green silk shirt.  JM wore
black jeans and a silvery-purple shirt (the same damn shirt he wore EVERY
show on that tour, it seems...).  What was kevin moore wearing?  Jeans and
a t-shirt.  Sure, he came out there in his black leather jacket, but he
took it off later.  Sure, they were black, but whose outfit doesn't fit?

Second time on I&W tour I saw them, it was HOT and an outdoor gig.  James
and Kev were wearing t-shirt and shorts.  (Actually, James was wearing
bike shorts.  that was more of James than most people need to see...)  JP
and JM were wearing the same as the previous gig.

Awake tour:  The uniform for the Awake tour was jeans and t-shirts.
Eveyone but JM was wearing jeans and t shirts.  (JM wore a dark blue
thermal henley.)  James wore a vest with his t-shirt.  Derek had his
jacket that he would wear, and occasionally a stocking cap, but it hardly
distracted from the jeans-and-t-shirt look of the band.

ACoS:  no real tour, but two holiday gigs at the birch Hell were the ones
I saw.  Derek began to get a little more flamboyant, but it was all black
so who could tell?  He also began to be a really flashy performer on the
keys, which improved their live show IMMENSELY.  And thanks god for that
because the Awake tour was probably the most uninspired of their shows I
have ever seen.

FII:  Damn.  Here's a show.  I saw them three times in support of FII.
The shows got progressively (no pun intended) every time.  And, it also
looked as though the band was paying a bit of attention to their "look"
for these shows.  Derek dressed like Derek.  James is seen in see-through
shirts as well as Derek.  JP and JM occasionally stray from the t-shirt in
favor of the silky shirt.  A unified band look.

So, it appears that the only once-or-ever DT member who ever demanded to
look different than anyone else was everyone's beloved Kevin Moore.
Derek's wardrobe and stage antics do NOT make him "stick out like a sore
thumb" as you people are so find of saying.  They INTENSIFIED the show,
and brought out the performance in all members of the band.  That will
most definitely be missed in the upcoming incarnation of Dream Theater.

Steve Z

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 23:34:00 -0600
From: "Brian Hayden" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed, email_address_removed
Subject: Re: yet another...
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


Responding to the message of Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:37:21 -0800 (PST)
from "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>:
> 
> 
> >>>To me, Derek was excactly what DT needed more of. Let's face it, prog 
> is
> goofy nerd music and any influences apart from progressive rock are
> necessary if anything worthwhile is to come out.<<<
> 
> Then you can always unsub from this list.

Damn, you got cheek boy. If you're gonna post twenty times a day, at least 
put it all in one or two or even five fucking posts. And quit the one-line 
bullshit, such as:

> I see. Led Zepplin. That explains it.

What was the point of that? If you wanna rip on Zeppelin, by your own logic 
maybe YOU shouldn't be here. They are one of DT's big influences.
 
> >>>Derek added some rock'n'roll that I found made the end result that 
> much better. No offense, but IMhighlysubjectiveO most of the neo prog 
> metal bands I've forced myself to listen to, incl. Kamelot and Shadow 
> Gallery, turned outto be crap.<<<
> 
> Queensryche? Fates Warning? Um... 

Queensryche is not prog, and FW hasn't done metal in years. They suck 
anyway, so it doesn't matter.

-Brian



------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:34:35 PST
From: "maX Verran" <email_address_removed>
To: email_address_removed
Subject: A man does rosey blooms.
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


>   When Dream Theater was in between singers, they at one point
>   considered becoming an instrumental band... At least, that's
>   what I remember reading back then.
Yeah, and I don't think that was just a rumor either.  


It's in the biography or the FAQ. Maybe both.

And just so Amanda Rosenblum knows, I have been catching up on several 
jams. In the future, I won't write so much crap.

ALSO, too many morons are bashing this or that DT player, and it sucks.

Maybe I'll unsub. I dunno. I unsubbed from TaDream because of that.


-maX

NP: Liquid Tension Experiment
    Fates Warning - Chasing Time
    Billy Idol - Rebel Yell

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 00:41:39 EST
From: email_address_removed
To: email_address_removed
Subject: LTE: 1/21/99 in NYC
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


Two words... Derick who?  Jordan was simply amazing, now lets hope that they
let him play his style on the next DT album.

The show kicked major ass
G!

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 01:18:06 -0500
From: Joe DeAngelo <email_address_removed>
To: YTSEJAM <email_address_removed>
Subject: D.C. Cooper
Message-ID: <message_id_removed>


max asked:
> I think D.C. Cooper from AOI is one totally awesome singer. What band 
> is he from?

He's in Royal Hunt, a first rate (semi)neoclassical progmetal band.
Check out their two kickass albums Paradox, and Moving Target.  (he's
not on the earlier ones).

Also he sings one track on Shadow Gallery's Tyranny.

-- 

- Joe D.  aka Magellan
  email_address_removed	ICQ # 1872723
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I swear on tomorrow- If you take this chance- Our lives are this moment
The music, the dance- And here in this labyrinth- Of lost mysteries
I close my eyes on this night- And you're all that I see
- Savatage, from "Not What You See"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 22:47:43 -0800
From: "Neil Evans" <email_address_removed>
To: <email_address_removed>
Subject: re: guess what?
Message-ID: <002101be45d3$1e5a4140$5e07aace@default>


Some disagreements with Mats...

>RMP is in it's genre a good record, but
>it's IMO elevator music, fuzak, keyboard-demo-songs

It sounds like non-metal instrumental prog to me.  Sure, it could use a
little guitar, but that was not the intention - listen to LTE for that.  All
in all, an amazing album full of variety and texture.

>Who
>am I to state this? Well no one but so's everyone else.

Fair enough.

>I fear that DT as a whole might lose
>momentum, direction, and eventually success.

I'd let DT worry about DT's career and success.  I think making any drastic
change shows a great degree of momentum and direction.  Clearly the band is
being aggressive about shaping what will be the future of DT.  A lack of
direction would be characterized by complacency.  Success will come with
great songwriting and playing, regardless of whether DT leans more or less
to the "progressive".  A conscious attempt to be successful is often the
nail in the coffin.

>Let's face it, prog is
>goofy nerd music and any influences apart from progressive rock are
>necessary if anything worthwhile is to come out.

Ouch!  Read that statement again.  You have just dismissed an entire genre
of music that most people here, including me, feel very strongly about.  I
think non-progressive influences are certainly healthy, but your statement
is a bit strong..

>the consensus in the YJ and PM camps are still that musical wanking is the
>highest order of art. What DT's always been to me is so much more than
>that,
>something that the copycats fail to deliver.

Why can't "musical wanking" and the "so much more" that you speak of
coexist?  That, to me, is what has always separated DT from the rest.  Some
of the best musical wanking + some of the best songwriting = unparalleled
music.

>And Marilyn Manson is about the only good thing to have
>happened to hard rock and popular culture in the late 90's

Must... express... strong... disagreement...

>I don't really doubt the next DT record
>with or without Kevin, Derek or Jordan will be good.

Only the future will tell, but I've got a hunch that it's going to kick ass.

>And I hope the band DOES NOT read and take ANY note or consideration of
>all this debate, they're the artists and we're only here to observe and to
>bitch. They rule, we buy. Simple as that.

Here I agree with you completely.  Anybody who thinks the band owes you
anything, including an explanation of recent events, is severely misguided.
Let's be glad that there are some incredibly talented musicians out there
making incredible music for us to enjoy, and that some of them are kind and
thoughtful enough to do us all sorts of favors: Xmas CDs, fan club shows,
video compilations, mini-tours, etc..  Dream Theater fans are some of the
luckiest around.

-Neil.


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End of YTSEJAM Digest 4604
**************************