YTSEJAM Digest 3500 Today's Topics: 1) The math of music by Pat Sullivan 2) Coldfire/Arash by Adam 3) Innocence Faded by Chris Calabrese 4) What a jerk off! by Chris Calabrese 5) New Feature! by NuGgeTMaN 6) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3497 (fwd) by "Richard A. Rivera" 7) Paynes Gray by Beth Elzinga 8) Re: What a jerk off! by Matt Johnston 9) Re: Arash by "Vincent G. LuPone" 10) Re: Lie Single by MTeiper 11) Re: Divine Regale by MTeiper 12) did anybody not read this post because of this subject? by "Partha S. Mukhopadhyay" 13) Re: YOU CALL YOURSELF "OPEN MINDED PROG MUSIC FAN" ? by "Mike Patrick" 14) Re: song length by a thing with a voice 15) 10,000 ytsejams and recommendations by "Alex O'Connell" 16) Well I knew it was comming.... by "Mark Philpot" 17) Elton John on Xmas CD by "Antoni Krasinski" 18) DT videos by "Wille Raab" 19) Re: Empty Tremor controversy by "Timothy P. Shough" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:47:44 -0500 From: Pat Sullivan To: email_address_removed Subject: The math of music Message-ID: My scores: WHEN DREAM AND DAY UNITE Score: 3.25 IMAGES AND WORDS Score: 3.5 AWAKE Score: 3.27 FALLING INTO INFINITY Score: 3.36 So *my* conclusion: The band has maintained a steady progression upward in their full-length releases since the first album, with the exception of I&W, which is generally regarded as their "masterpiece". Of course, all this bullshit assumes that the arbitrary numbers anyone chooses to assign to each song have some real-world concrete value, and that subjective personal issues have now bearing on the ratings. I could just as easily have changed the numbers above to make them come out to whatever the hell I wanted them to say, much as I'm sure the original poster did. TRUE conclusion: This so-called "mathematical model" is about as reliable as the clueless reviews in magazines that we are always deriding on this list. Why should we believe *anyone's* "4-star" rating? Just because they are a fan? I think not. _____Pat Sullivan_____________________________________ E-Mail: email_address_removed WWW: http://www.ici.net/cust_pages/psull/psull.html IRC: DDictator ICQ: 2049374 ______________________________________________________ It's not hard to meet expenses, they're everywhere. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:59:43 -0500 From: Adam To: email_address_removed Subject: Coldfire/Arash Message-ID: >What does having children have to to with it...look at Mike Portnoy. >You call us close minded but look in the mirror Arashole.....you are the >pot calling the kettle black! >Next time you feel the urge to post...stop...think long and hard about >what you say...and then think some more...then don't post. Jesus Christ. I usually don't reply to blatant obnoxiousness like this, but I had to. Arash has just been trying to get us into one of his new favorite bands, and he gets this oh-so-mature "Arashole" response. I urge you to consider your own advice in stopping to think before you post. Posts like this are completely unnecessary and it leads to other posts that _should_ be unnecessary (like mine right now). If you're not interested in the band or don't agree with his methods of pushing them, ignore them and avoid the infantile personal attacks. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:17:19 -0500 From: Chris Calabrese To: email_address_removed Subject: Innocence Faded Message-ID: Can someone please tell me why everyone has a problem with Innocence Faded ??? I keep seeing people bashing it here, and it's beginning to piss me off. Innocence Faded is probably one of my 10 favorite Dream Theater songs, and I truly wish they would play it as much a they play songs like Pull Me Under. Can someone please tell me whats so bad about it? There's so much I love about it...the guitar intro...the vocals section when Labrie hits that high note on the line "Wearing apathetic displays, sharing flesh like envy in cages..." I love the guitar solo. And the local radio station here, (well one of 2 at my school) has all the DT albums and I call a few times a week and request a DT song, and other than Metropolis, Another Day, Ytsejam, and Lines in the Sand, it's one of the most frequently played DT songs on there. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:27:45 -0500 From: Chris Calabrese To: email_address_removed Subject: What a jerk off! Message-ID: I just read some jerk off who made a rating system of 1 to 5 for DT songs. This guy must have his thumb up his ass. He's obviously into Dream Theater entirely for the "balls and chunk" aspect of it. He's probably one of those jerks that thinks DT shows are the places for mosh pits...ya know waht? THEY'RE NOT! You want balls and chunk? Go listen to some Slayer. (no disrespect to Slayer...I'm a fan myself) But damn it, I'm sick and tired of this shit. I'm not even gonna go into the mosh thing! The last thing I want at a DT show is some 16 year old faggot hitting me in the head. This fucker had songs like Hollow Years, Anna Lee, Another Day, Take Away My Pain, LSOAD, Innocence Faded, and Surrounded ranked as 1's and 0's, yet songs like The Mirror, Lie, Metropolis, and LITS ranked much higher. Now I love all those songs, but it's become obvious to me that this idiot has the idea that "songs like Anna Lee are pussy songs, cuz they're not heavy and fast." That attitude just pisses me off. I'm sorry I'm coming off as an asshole here...but I'm really sick and tired of this shit! Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:43:03 -0500 (EST) From: NuGgeTMaN To: email_address_removed Subject: New Feature! Message-ID: For all you jammers that frequently browse LSOAR, check out our new messageboard. It's kinda cheesey, but it's a chance to drop a line to other people who check it out, also it gives you a chance to advertise stuff for free. Also, if someone wants to make a graphic to link to it from LSOAR I could use one...you'll get credit for it, and who knows maybe I'll be able to come up with some way to reward ya for your efforts. Normally I'd design one myself, but right now my only access to the net is in a computer lab, so I can't really do graphic design here. Have fun, keep it clean, and keep on Ytsejammin' -Cheers! _*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_* ^ According to the circle of fifths, and the order of sharps and flats: ^ ^ If the alphabet continued as notes progressed (Using Major Key Sigs) ^ ^ (i.e. A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, etc.) eventually the key of Z Major ^ ^ would have 4 sharps. ^ ^ "Just Lighten up and listen to the Music" -Kevin Moore (inside joke) ^ ^ Eric Moegling: Manager for "Lifting Shadows Off A Ring" ^ ^ and "Progressive Genius" ^ ^ The Dream theater and Progressive Metal WebRings ^ ^ HOMEPAGE - http://www.wezl.org/NuGgeTMaN or http://www.wezl.org/lift ^ ^_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:42:34 -0500 (EST) From: "Richard A. Rivera" To: Dream Theater Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3497 (fwd) Message-ID: On Sat, 24 Jan 1998 email_address_removed wrote: > How does one go about copyrighting a song (in the US)? Does it have to be > finalized, or can it just be an idea/fragment or a demo? As long as you have the song in a tangible form (tape, sheet music, etc) it is technically copyrighted. But just having it in some form doesn't do you much good in the case of somebody making an infringement claim against you. Therefore, you need some way to place a date on the song's creation. You can do this one of two ways: the real way or the "poor man's" way. The real way is to register it in Washington. The "poor man's copyright" is simply mailing a copy of the tape to yourself (but DON'T OPEN IT). That way you have the postmarked date as a reference. There are certain benefits to registering it the real way, but if you're pressed for cash or are lazy, then the poor-man's way will get the job done. As far as whether you can copy an idea or fragment, there is no reason that you couldn't, but you're looking at a lot of paper work or trips to the post office. I would suggest copyrighting a fragment when: 1) You're going to collaborate w/ other writers 2) You're going to perform it live Richie P.S. As an ammendment to my post about Firehouse, there actually is some DTC there. In Metal Edge's year-end issue, they asked a bunch of rockers their top five favorite albums on 1997 and Bill Leverty (Firehouse guitarist) named FII as his third pick ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 15:01:31 -0500 From: Beth Elzinga To: "'email_address_removed'" Subject: Paynes Gray Message-ID: Ok guys, I'm a little behind on jams, and I realize that this might be a little late. I'm sorry if I'm rehashing what someone else already posted. I got Kadath Decoded about a month ago now from lasers edge. I think the music itself could probably be worth all Ken's raving about it. Imagine spanish guitar and piano going to electric with eerie synth noises going to some nightmare noises and, in one song, cats yowling. :) The singers were a little annoying at first, but that's just IMHO. It all depends on your taste. They just didn't seem as if they were as right on as they could be. Otherwise, I think the album is really good. The overall story is taken from one of J.P. Lovecraft's books, and is about a man who dreams about the city of Kadath every night. Pretty cool stuff. Like I said, I hope I'm not repeating anybody. Beth begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(B 4`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`+ $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````9P`````` M``"U.\+ +'<0&J&\" `K*E;"%0```"TC04H71S96IA;4!A>"YC;VT`4TU44 !Y='-E M:F%M0&%X+F-O;0``'@`", $````%````4TU44 `````>``,P`0````\```!Y M='-E:F%M0&%X+F-O;0```P`5# $````#`/X/!@```!X``3 !````$0```"=Y M='-E:F%M0&%X+F-O;2<``````@$+, $````4````4TU44#I95%-%2D%-0$%8 M+D-/30`#```Y``````L`0#H!`````@'V#P$````$`````````KHV`02 `0`, M````4&%Y;F5S($=R87D`(P0!!8 #``X```#.!P$`&0`/``$`'P```!X!`2" M`P`.````S@:4Y]P,Y6"$=&H;5"2!\$` M````'@`># $````%````4TU44 `````>`!\,`0```!D```!L:7I 9G)E96YE M="YM86-A=&%W82YOB@#``<0D@(``!X`"! !````90`` M`$]+1U594RQ)34%,25143$5"14A)3D1/3DI!35,L04Y$25)%04Q)6D542$%4 M5$A)4TU)1TA40D5!3$E45$Q%3$%414E-4T]24EE)1DE-4D5(05-(24Y'5TA! M5%-/345/3D5%3%,``````@$)$ $````K`P``)P,``(,$``!,6D9U,*?7M_\` M"@$/`A4"I /D!>L"@P!0$P-4`@!C: K 0!S+"!))VT@80@@ M;&D"0&QE(&(D96@+@&0@`B @:IQA;1B!`' 9T$D@%-#I!T!I>AE@=!' !4 ; M8($$`"!M:6=H= J%AQF &.@+8'1E+B 8H^)S!;!R>2 &D!BC%-#%$ `B 98&5L$? @"H6+!T :X60><'!O('G_)/(E< 0`!Y$N=Q_R)6 <$O\`P!30,/8:@1B0"X 9X2"GMQXP M%H 8D&,;@ 0@>26 IQD0%H =P#HI(BQ4)\'W`) 6@"8R=P20'-D`<"5PIGD? M8AN!9FD1X'08D&YB)($;8BJQ:B@`!4!)>$U(3R:W))$J40VP< J%_S>4*L$< M$AGB/K$_$RC$&8#5'<%/)[%R`_%E&)$G2?L'0#F@;0J%&]$:XBF!(R#W!' ] M)!G@=@20*D(AT 6PR1%)[)C&2 _1T>1(V5E[T6A'G R M4QW!4!30`D!!0IL&\$8!=0W0(AU,:4; _1JQ7<&X"& (AU"$@`OQA/Q``%5( `#`! 0``````,`$1 ````` M0 `',,#5R$++*;T!0 `(,,#5R$++*;T!'@`]``$````!``````````,`#33] %-P``Y%S5 ` end ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 12:17:41 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Johnston To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: What a jerk off! Message-ID: On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Chris Calabrese wrote: > >attitude just pisses me off. I'm sorry I'm coming off as an asshole >here...but I'm really sick and tired of this shit! > I think the joke's on you... ..I took it as a joke (especially when he said, "and since I know everything" or something like that). Grow a sense of humor, unless it's a misdomenor offense to grow/own one in your state. > Chris > --Matt --------------------------------------------------------------------- "..." --James LaBrie, "Hell's Kitchen" --------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:29:20 -0700 From: "Vincent G. LuPone" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Arash Message-ID: Arash wrote this: >Btw, I was sure, graham would be the first jammers, >who would replay to this mail :) >We will be friends forever ;) I TRULY FEELLS FOUR GRAHAAM ?!?!?!?!? ~Vinnie ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 15:31:04 EST From: MTeiper To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Lie Single Message-ID: Hello - In a message dated 98-01-25 13:09:34 EST, you write: << This has nothing to do with my question, but it's a good demo so I thought I'd like to see in here again :-) My question... What songs are on the Lie single? >> Lie (EDIT) Space-Dye Vest To Live Forever Another Day (LIVE Hope this helps... Laterz... - Matt T. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 15:48:04 EST From: MTeiper To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Divine Regale Message-ID: Hey All - Got a question for y'all... Can anybody point me to some Divine Regale sound files on the web? I found the official web page out there, but sounds were "coming soon". :-( I think these were the guys that opened for FW recently, right? I found a CD of theirs on Metal Blade in the store, and I wanted to give 'em a try before I bought it. Private e-mail would be fine. Thanks a lot. - Matt T. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 16:54:24 -0500 (EST) From: "Partha S. Mukhopadhyay" To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: did anybody not read this post because of this subject? Message-ID: about that italian band that I absolutely must hear.....arash, i sure hope they're paying you for the publicity....... here's a band that i think y'all should look into....it's been mentioned before, called Ozric Tentacles.....man this is weird crazy cool jazz prog fusion out of this head majorly freaky stuff..... partha np:.... Ozric Tentacles: Strangitude ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 18:15:59 -0500 From: "Mike Patrick" To: "DT" Subject: Re: YOU CALL YOURSELF "OPEN MINDED PROG MUSIC FAN" ? Message-ID: I won't say anything about Arash, except it's a pretty safe bet he's never read 'How to Make Friends and Influence People'. And Empty Tremor? Well...you know, I spent the better part of yesterday combing the Web checking out bands that I've been meaning to, well, check out, and I've come to the following conclusion: just because a band is 'prog' and therefore contains a lot of the elements that I love so well, does not mean that I will find them at all compelling. Empty Tremor? Wow, they do have chops to burn, but then so do most 'prog' bands. And given their ages, you've really got to think that they are onto something. Mayadome? Same thing. But is anyone else but me getting sick of 'prog' cliches? I mean, get a drummer that has mastered the double bass (and therefore plays NOTHING else) and a guitarist, bassist, and keybordist who can play unison, repeating sixteenth-note patterns, and BOOM, you've got yourself a 'prog' band. And again, I'm going off of only what I've been able to hear online, but I've gotten this impression from bands like Quite Room, Spiral Architect, etc. It may be a bit harsh, but I call it 'cookiecutter prog'. It's all good, but 'good' in the face of 'great' just isn't that interesting. After hearing a lot of the up and coming bands, I'm really all that much more into DT, Lemur Voice, Shadow Gallery, Spock's, Fates, etc. There's something in their sounds which sets them apart from not only the aforementioned bands, but also from each other. Mike Patrick Indianapolis, IN email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:07:31 -0500 (EST) From: a thing with a voice To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: song length Message-ID: > > Oh, if you're going to quantify quality, do not forget to take quantity > (length of songs) into account. Colleges do this by multiplying the grade > point by the credit hours, then dividing by total credit hours. Try > minutes (round up)... I don't know. It only takes me a moment to begin on track 3 when playing Images and Words, so does it really matter how long Pull Me Under is? Also, if Ytse Jam were twice as long, would it be a better song, and would WDADU be a better album? You'd probably have to count the song as less on account of rambling. To use other bands as example, one "Knots" by Gentle Giant is far superior to one "The Camera Eye" by Rush (still a classic song, three times as long), and so my opinion would be that "Knots" contributes more to OCTOPUS than TCE contributes to "MOVING PICTURES." -=- "I know you all love Billy Ray Cyrus... Fuck, any woman here would fucking almost break her pelvis to open her legs for that mongoloid fuck to drop his filthy cracker seed into your fucking womb. Liar! Liars!" -- Hicks --------------------==== Broken via True Love ====------------------- http://www.afn.org/~afn39111 Butcher, Rape, Smash to Pieces ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:10:54 -0500 From: "Alex O'Connell" To: email_address_removed Subject: 10,000 ytsejams and recommendations Message-ID: Eckie scribbled: >mebbe 'cuz only about 4 or so people are actually reading each and every ytsejam >email goin' through the system nowadays? 90 emails a day is a bit overwhelming >sometimes, especially with a busy school schedule. >Or maybe that's just me. :P No, I hear you, man. I get the digests, and even those come 'round the clock. It's frightening, actually, the volume of email I've gotten since I signed up to this list. >Well...as far as "alternatives" to Dream Theater, I'm quite impressed >(i.e., FLOORED) by some of the bands that some of yous guys recommended >like Symphony X and Savatage an' Stratovarious an', can't forget Iron >Savior, and Lemur Voice an...well, I could go on. Am still on a quest to hunt down and listen to music from some of the others, but just wanted to commend you on mentioning SAVATAGE! Rock on, all. Alex ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:15:13 -0800 From: "Mark Philpot" To: Subject: Well I knew it was comming.... Message-ID: <01bd29de$b5cc8540$588c15cf@markphil> In responce to Matt Johnston... On Sat, 24 Jan 1998, Mark Philpot wrote: >HELL NO! Most every song DT has released has been a hallmark in some >form!!! Besides for a few songs on FII (BMS, YNM) EVERY SINGLE SONG is a >work of art! There was a post not long ago about the worst DT song... So, every song kicks ass, excpet for the ones that don't. ^_^ Very (and I mean this honestly) logically sound. Unfortulately, you succeeded in making no point whatsoever. Sorry. Come again drive thru. Yeah, I knew I had it comming... But let me make myself more clear... There is no DT song I don't like.... I just LOVE some more than others... When I first heard FII, I though YNM was a great song... but after having listened to it a whole bunch of times, I relize that it is not one of DT's better creations... I still like it though.... But your right, the way I posted it I succeeded in making no point, but I've come back to the drive thru and hopefully have successfully reorderd. Every song kicks ass... just some just get a little further up.... :) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 23:56:35 +0100 From: "Antoni Krasinski" To: Subject: Elton John on Xmas CD Message-ID: Hi! I don't remember if this was discussed here before, but on the Xmas CD on track 20 I can hear Elton John's 'Goodbye Yellow Brick Road' (1:23 - 1:56). Have anyone of you noticed that? Antoni Krasinski email_address_removed.pl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 00:17:38 +0100 From: "Wille Raab" To: "Ytsejab" Subject: DT videos Message-ID: I've just seen three DT videos for the first time, and (sadly) I must say -- they were *B* *A* *D*!!!! They were all made in the same way, with some cross-fading and some light effects.. Even though I don't remember what songs it was (they're that bad...), it could've been any of the I&W songs... (yee.. I really sound bad.. ;-/ ) They would really have good use of a new video producer ... or at least that's what I think.. // Moose ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:41:59 -0800 From: "Timothy P. Shough" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Empty Tremor controversy Message-ID: > HAH ! This is just your opinion :) > Off the top of my head I can rattle off ten albums that IMO are equal to > I&W > and better than Awake, but I am forbidden by the no top ten rule :) Go for it, Graham! To hell with the no-top-ten rule! To hell with open-mindedness!!! No, forget that... How about Vauxdvihl? I've heard quite a bit about them but can't seem to find their CD here in the states. Is is worth searching (and ultimately shelling out big bucks) for? I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks. Tim ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3500 **************************