YTSEJAM Digest 3369 Today's Topics: 1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3367 by email_address_removed 2) Re: For those going to the Atlanta show... (ACOS TAB project) by "Brian Hayden" 3) by "Charlie Korch" 4) Re: LaBrie by Adam 5) Re: Compositional Process by "Eric LaRue" 6) Re: Scott's ravings about Rush and LaBrie by "Eric LaRue" 7) Re: Savatage by "Vincent G. LuPone" 8) Re: For those going to the Atlanta show... (ACOS TAB project) by Rogerio Brito 9) Fasten Your Seat Belts! by Nicholas Bogovich 10) Hartford, Connecticut Show by YtseJim 11) Re: TSO/Savatage/KTA1/KTA2/OFB by Rogerio Brito 12) RE: Kings X and 15% DT by AL 13) Yes, you should see Yes. But plan to travel. by Andrew James Embler 14) Re: Yes by "Brian P. Kelley" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 17:29:23 -0500 (EST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3367 Message-ID: >I've always felt that a live setting is the worst place to get a first >exposure to a band's work, simply because it's so hard to make out >everything that's going on. any opinions on if a Yes concert would still I think that depends: If it's a band I would not normally be at all interested in, seeing them live could only help. Example: I'm as far from a Snoop Doggy Dog fan as can be; the closest thing to rap that I even own is one Beastie Boys album. But, when I saw Snoop play when I went to see SNL, I thought it was really cool. He's got a definite funk that I didn't appreciate before. On the other hand, what little enjoyment I got from Weezer turned to nil when I saw them live. So, I guess I have no idea. josh email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 97 16:34:13 -0600 From: "Brian Hayden" To: email_address_removed, email_address_removed Subject: Re: For those going to the Atlanta show... (ACOS TAB project) Message-ID: Responding to the message of from email_address_removed: > > > > handed to him a few months ago. In particular, I want to know: > > > > 1) If he approves/disapproves of us doing this. > > Why would he disapprove of fans trying to figure out his own songs and > teaching each other? He knows tab books are rip-offs nowadays! :) I'm curious about something. I read in some guitar magazine that Petrucci doesn't even know how to use tab, that he always uses regular staff notation. Is this true? -Brian ******************************************************************************** "So understand, don't waste your time always searching for those wasted years. Face up, make your stand, and realize you're living in the golden years." -Adrian Smith ******************************************************************************** Coleridge on IRC ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 18:00:38 -0400 From: "Charlie Korch" To: email_address_removed Message-ID: >From what I recall, the setlist went something like this: >1) APSOG >encore 1: >1) At Fates Hands >2) Point of View >3) a song I didn't recognize, sorry, but with VICIOUS time changes I think the name of that song is "The Ivory Gate Of Dreams" or something like that. >encore 2: >1) The Eleventh Hour >run directly into 2) Point of View Actually, the last song was Monument. It was killer, although it would have been nice to hear the second guitar, instead of the keys subbing for the now Fate-less Frank Aresti. > while Zonder, madman that he is, made it look like >having four feet and eight arms was nothing unusual.< Zonder was the highlight for me. His playing has never ceased to amaze me. After the show someone asked Mark "how did you get so good, and how do I get that good". Zonder replied a simple "lots of practice". >Jim was a very spare, >economical player; not a smidgen of wasted motion -- but his solos >blistered and his sound was incredible.< This is the one place the we see it differently. I have come to think of Jim as a great song writer only. His solos (or lack of) leave a lot to be desired IMO. I really wish Fates had a second guitarist who could just shred on top of their beautiful solo sections. I don't dislike Jim's playing. I just don't think it is up to par with other Prog guitarists out there. > And finally, Ray Alder -- those of >you who think the vocals on FW's albums are all done with effects, smoke >and mirrors -- you can just forget that. Ray has one of the strongest >voices I've heard in concert. < I agree 100%. Ray's voice was fantastic, and to top it off he was very modest. After the show, I asked him how he sings like that night after night, and he said "oh, not every night"......."Thank you". >Didn't get to talk to Mark (he just popped out, signed a couple liners and >disappeared again like smoke) but I did catch a snippet of conversation >between him and one of the other fans that might interest: there's going >to be a Fates video released soon. It will feature material from their >European tour, and ought to be out within a couple months. Yeah, Mark was in and out of the cold air before you knew it. I guess it was because he was the only one in shorts, and he looked like he just got out of the shower. His hair was soaking wet. >DT in Atlanta tomorrow. See you Ytses there...< See you there. Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 18:29:49 -0500 From: Adam To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: LaBrie Message-ID: >>Why do you think they don't play WDADU songs in concert anymore >>(except for Ytsejam)? It's because James is such a fucking baby he can't >>handle >>singing songs from another singer. > >I guess that's why he's singing "To Live Forever" and "A Fortune In Lies" on >my LiT video, huh? :) I don't know if you've heard it, but recently (spring Euro tour, etc) they've done an INCREDIBLE rendition of The Killing Hand. It doesn't have the soaring (screaming?) vocals of the LATM version (or most I&W era TKHs), but it's easily the best selection during those shows. Great guitar/keys improvs, a really cool transition into/out of Carol of the Belles, and a more jazzed up version of the instrumental intro (can't really be called Another Hand). It's obvious they put alot of effort into changing this song (one of those reall old, "another singer" songs) into something that "jives" (for lack of a better word) with their current style. Now, if we could only get 'em to play it again during the FII tour. ARGH! I better not have to suffer only hearing this masterpiece on bootlegs... :) DT in ATLANTA = 26 _HOURS_!!!!!!!!!!!!! Adam ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 15:57:56 PST From: "Eric LaRue" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Compositional Process Message-ID: >> What I'm curious about is, how are they able to craft their songs so >> wonderfully if they've got five conflicting ideas running about? Does >> the one who wrote the lyrics come up with a musical idea and then they >> all add their own things to it? Is it a democracy? How does this work? > >The answer is simple: jamming > >A member brings a cool little riff he has, and they jam on it. They >record the jam, and then they listen back, take out the cool parts, >and work that into a song. I've done that with my last band, and i >have to say it's the funnest method of composition ever. When you >listen to the tape its like "Did i play that? How in the FUCK did I >play that?? Thats Awesome!!" > >Of course, in an interview w/ JM somebody posted here, he said that >ToT was the first song were he had general sketch of a song before he >showed it to the band. Then they added their ideas to it, and >helped it come to life > >that's that, >Ern > > Well, I'm sure that works in some cases. Indeed, that is what many bands do to write their songs, so don't take this as a knock on jamming. It just seems that the level of complexity that DT's songs have(especially on I&W) is just too high for a seemingly random process. I was wondering if what DT went through was somewhat more organized. Just my 2c Complete with burning guitars, bashed up drum sets and sealed with a kiss, Eric Paul LaRue "Take hold of the flame. Don't you see life's a game? So take hold of the flame. You've got nothing to lose, but everything to gain!" Queensryche-"Take Hold of the Flame" http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Towers/6289 "Mon pere. Quel buffoon."-Bart Simpson ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 16:04:02 PST From: "Eric LaRue" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Scott's ravings about Rush and LaBrie Message-ID: >>And if you can listen to anything Rush put out AFTER Hemispheres >>and say they didn't go commercial then you're either not paying >>attention or have an IQ of a turnip! They went from writing some >>of the greatest rock songs of all time, prog or not, to becoming >>a Human League/Eurythmics clone in the 80's. That shit from Signals >>all the way through Hold Your Fire is all synth pop. I'm not saying >>it's all bad, but most of it sucks (sorry Merlo, it had to be said ;-) ). >>It wasn't until Presto that they started getting back more towards >>guitar oriented music and stopped trying to get airplay in the >>discos. > >Oh, now you've done it. You've just flamed some of my all time favorite >music. Signals has some great songs, chief among them "Subdivisions" which >is my favorite Rush song, and in my top 10 of all time (all artists). Not >only that, but IMO Hold Your Fire is the best album they have put out since >Moving Pictures. But I do agree with, and like the fact, that they've moved >back into guitar-oriented rock, and gotten a more raw sound as a result. >Both Counterparts and T4E are magnificent in this regard. Once I heard a song that sounded like an 80s synthpop song, and the DJ said it was Rush. I don't think I heard the song title. Could you give me some direction as to what album this was? Thanx! Complete with burning guitars, bashed up drum sets and sealed with a kiss, Eric Paul LaRue "Take hold of the flame. Don't you see life's a game? So take hold of the flame. You've got nothing to lose, but everything to gain!" Queensryche-"Take Hold of the Flame" http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Towers/6289 "Mon pere. Quel buffoon."-Bart Simpson ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 17:16:39 -0700 From: "Vincent G. LuPone" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Savatage Message-ID: At 08:55 AM 12/15/97 -0800, Eric wrote: >I just recently got DWD, and I think that musically, it is wonderful! I >particularly like "This Isn't What We Meant," "One Child," "Christmas >Eve/Sarajevo 12/24," and "Not What You See." However, I think the lead >singer's voice is a little too gravelly for my taste. Especially, in >the title track, he sounds a little too much like James Hetfield. Any >differing opinions? Yeah man, I mean...that's the reason I like his singing sooooo much. Zak Stevens and James Hetfield, along with others like John Bush (Anthrax) and Phil Rind (Sacred Reich) all posess my FAVORITE types of vocals. The Tate/LaBrie style is my second fav :) On that same note, Billy Corgan sucks. >Are there any other Savatage albums anyone would recommend? I already >asked for "Streets" for Xmas, but I was wondering if any of the others >would be a good investment. EDGE OF THORNS EDGE OF THORNS EDGE OF THORNS EDGE OF THORNS EDGE OF THORNS EDGE OF THORNS >Complete with burning guitars, bashed up drum sets and sealed with a >kiss, Ah yes...the good ol' days. :) Peace and love, and good happiness stuff, ~Vince =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= | http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Palms/6933 | -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 22:21:23 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: For those going to the Atlanta show... (ACOS TAB project) Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Dec 1997 email_address_removed wrote: > > handed to him a few months ago. In particular, I want to know: > > > > 1) If he approves/disapproves of us doing this. > > Why would he disapprove of fans trying to figure out his own songs and > teaching each other? He knows tab books are rip-offs nowadays! :) When I talked to him, he said that he would be very happy to correct everything in the tab. He said: "I don't want people playing my things erroneously" (it is paraphrased, but that's the essence). > ~Eckie Again []s, Roger... -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - email_address_removed.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 19:24:05 EST From: Nicholas Bogovich To: email_address_removed Cc: email_address_removed Subject: Fasten Your Seat Belts! Message-ID: Hey guys, I just put an MP3 of the "Fasten Your Seat Belts" version of Ytsejam on my web page. Check it out if you get a chance - it's a great performance of it! Oh, here's the link: http://web.mit.edu/bogie/ Just go to the 'Bogie's Site of the Day' Link. Jam on, Nick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 19:33:46 -0500 From: YtseJim To: email_address_removed, email_address_removed, email_address_removed Subject: Hartford, Connecticut Show Message-ID: Dream Theater with Big Wreck All Ages - Jan. 2, 1998 Friday 8:00pm Webster Theater, Hartford, Connecticut Price of tix: $16.00 Tickets Available Through Pro-Tix Anywhere --> 1-800-477-6849 Connecticut --> 860-422-0000 TICKETS ON SALE NOW!!!!! hope this helps YtseJim ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 22:41:56 -0200 (EDT) From: Rogerio Brito To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: TSO/Savatage/KTA1/KTA2/OFB Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Dec 1997, Parffit Jim Balsanelli da Silva wrote: > * Could anybody send me details about TSO and Savatage CDs??? Something > like the CD title, label, number, year, etc... I'd like to purchase some > CDs, but I need all the details because I live in the South Side of > Brazil... Thanks for the information!!!! You can e-mail me privately or > "jammely" (did you like the new word?)... If you can't find the hardest-to-find bootlegs here in Sao Paulo (I don't know what you mean by "South Side of Brazil" -- I think you mean Southeast Region?), then maybe you're looking on the wrong places, definitely. Ever heard of "Galeria do Rock"? That's the worst place to be if your wallet is empty, 'cause you'll find things that you don't even imagine could ever exist. BTW, *DO* get the Trans Siberian Orchestra CD. It is called "Christmas Eve and other histories". Talk about goosebump moments. > OFB: > * I think that everyone here in Ytsejam would be VERY happy if DT > release another video for the last tour... Every time I see Images and > Tour - Live in Tokyo (the official VHS from Japan Tour), I think about > all the Awake and Falling Into Infinity stuff coming to us in video > mode... Every day would be a DT show day!!! You may have a video from the "Awake" tour with pretty decent quality. That's the Japan Pay-Per-View show. I think Mike Bahr sells copies of this video (maybe other people can be interested in this also). See . But you may also contact me for some trades... :-) > Just imagining... > > "..." -- Derek Sherinian, Mike Portnoy - The Silent Man Hey, drop this signature. This isn't funny after the Hell's Kitchen sig that's been here on the 'jam. That was creative. But this one is not as good, since it doesn't have originality. BTW, Derek wasn't in Dream Theater when "The Silent Man" was recorded. And you can definitely hear some of Kevin Moore's keyboards from about 2:00 to 2:15. BTW2, the eletric version of TSM "kicks ass". []s, Roger... -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Rogerio Brito - email_address_removed.br - http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Undergraduate Computer Science Student - "Windows? Linux and X!" Bootleg/trade page: http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito/bootleg.html "Life is ours, we live it our way (...) / And nothing else matters" James Hetfield (Metallica), Nothing Else Matters =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 19:28:46 -0600 From: AL To: YTSE Jammers Subject: RE: Kings X and 15% DT Message-ID: I will address two issues here. First, for the person that was interested in what King=92s X was like, I can offer this, Trying to describe Kings X to someone is as difficult as trying to describe DT to someone that has never heard them before. No two albums sound alike, if you are in to the heavier stuff, I would recommend the CD Dogman. If you are in to the more mellow creative stuff, I would suggest the Gretchen Goes To Nebraska disk. And somewhere in between the newer Ear Candy disk. I myself have a hard time deciding between GGTN & Dogman as a favorite. As far a musicianship goes, all three members can hold their own quite well. The lyrics are no where near as complex as DT, but never the less, very entertaining. Most songs have a positive message and most certainly a Christian slant. Personally speaking, DT is my all time favorite, but the to give you a idea of my music tastes, here are some of my favorite bands. Dream Theater, Kings X, Rush, YES, Queensryche, Deep Purple, Alice In Chains, Type O Negative, Fates Warning, Uriah Heep, The Scorpions, The Alan Parsons Project, Krokus, old Van Halen, Aldo Nova, Whitesnake, old Cheap Trick, Megadeth and Old Black Sabbath. If you enjoy most of the bands I mentioned, then I think you would like Kings X. Keep in mind that my music interests are not limited to the heavier rock stuff, I also enjoy New Age, Jazz and blues. To address the second topic ( RE: AL 15% DT) I realize that more than DT will be discussed here, I am just tired of stupid jokes, advertising for non music related web pages, and mention of some of the here today, gone tomorrow no talent bands. I can see those jackasses on MTV any time I want. I do appreciate the insight into other talent I might not otherwise be aware of. Til next time, See ya, AL=85 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 17:30:10 -0800 (PST) From: Andrew James Embler To: email_address_removed Subject: Yes, you should see Yes. But plan to travel. Message-ID: Jim Beavens wrote: > Yes is slated to come to Portland on January 2nd As a Portland Jammer, I was looking forward to this since I first read about the second leg of their tour. (Which was beginning in Portland on January 2nd.) Unfortunately for us Northwest Yes fans, I recently read the following at Notes From the Edge, an internet Yes source. (http://www.nfte.org). I apologize if this has already been posted, it's a pain reading through many Ytsejam's in Pine. Here's the news: Yes' 1998 tour of the NW USA and Canada has been postponed until after their tour of Europe. Please contact point of purchase for refund information. Yes apologizes for any inconvenience. Bummer huh. Well, sometime in the Spring, then. Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 22:09:13 -0500 From: "Brian P. Kelley" To: "Yes Jam?!?" Subject: Re: Yes Message-ID: >>Any opinions on if a Yes concert would still be enjoyable to a newbie? >> >>Eagerly awaiting to be convinced, >> > > While I agree with you that hearing the studio album first is >often the best way to go, in this case I'd still recommend seeing the >live show. In my experience, Yes always puts on a very strong performance >which can be enjoyed even if you're not all that familiar with the music. >They have a good stage presence and put on a very fun show (it helps if you >have decent seats so you can see how much fun they're having up there). >I find their music to be very powerful live. >Yes songs and a few 'obscure' Yes songs. If you want to hear their classic >stuff, just buy "Classic Yes" (a best of collection) which has a very good >selection of their songs and was recently remastered. > Good luck! > > Steve Wow! This is just great to hear some talk about Yes on the Jam finally. I guess I was a little too timid to start a Yes thread or anything! I would definitely consider Yes to be in my Top 10 All-Time Favs (along w/DT, Rush, Floyd, King Crimson, Zappa, etc...) Now many people think that this 70s progressive rock craze started with Rush. That may be true to an extent, but you actually should go back in time about 3-4 years with Yes and Emerson Lake and Palmer. These bands were playing 20-minute epics a few years before 2112 or Hemispheres. Take "Tales from Topographic Oceans" for instance -- a brilliant masterpiece with one long theme on each of four sides. Once Yes acquired Steve Howe for "The Yes Album" after the departure of Peter Banks, the band totally expanded the boundaries and possibilities of their compositions. Note that I say "compositions" and not "songs" here. Yes and ELP were WAY ahead of their time in 1972. I cannot conceivably see how they performed their music with such intense, rigorous precision and make it sound so beautiful! Yes were one of the first rock bands to experiment heavily with wild time signatures and long, conceptual themes. Listen to tracks like "Heart Of The Sunrise" of "Sound Chaser" (one of my all-time favs). They're just fucking crazy!!!! When "Close To The Edge" came out, it was evident that their true goal was to play the music they loved as oppose to sell millions of records and get tons of airplay. Ironically, they STILL managed to do that -- but without giving in totally to the "big corporate machine". They were fortunate to have Atlantic be so flexible with Eddy Offord's production of those albums of the early-mid 70s. "90125" was the first Yes album I bought and though I enjoyed it quite alot, upon further exploring earlier works, I was just as impressed and morely blown away by their musical virtuosity. I think Chris Squire is a very underrated bass player in certain circles. I can't believe the kind of wild, funky shit he plays on his classic Rickenbacker -- those trebly, crude bass tones send a chill down my spine. He's easily in the Top 10 bassists in the world!!! (well, maybe 20 :) I like Steve Howe alot better than Trevor Rabin (the 80's-era guitarist). Though Rabin was (and still is) an exceptional guitarist/singer/songwriter, he's just too cheesy for my tastes! Howe, on the other hand, was never a real flashy guitarist but what this man can play is enough to move mountains! As far as both acoustic and electric Howe compositions, nobody plays with equal beauty and precision as does Steve Howe. Not to rag on any other phenomenal guitarists out there, but I have heard this from many musicians far and wide who have seen Howe live. I have yet to see him live but just by hearing him on Yes albums, that magic is enough for me! :) Alan White is a great drummer, though I prefer Bill Bruford over him anyday. Bruford is a lot more experimental and daring, which was his main motive for him leaving Yes for King Crimson (c. 1973). Still, White has held the drumming throne to this day and nobody else can do a better job keeping a rhythm/groove with Squire. Rick Wakeman's jumpy Poly-Moog chords run around my head everytime I hear them. He was probably the most classically trained of all the Yes members (listen to "Canns and Brahms" from Fragile). It's too bad he's left Yes for a "now third time" and "for good" :( after 1996. And who can forget the soulful, spiritual vocalist Jon Anderson? I know alot of people may not be able to stand his high soprano, but I think he's one of the most gifted natural singers in the world. He puts hardly any effort into his singing voice, which sounds almost identical to his regular talking voice. His words are truly an inspiration to me, as well as the whole of Yes, when I am feeling down or lonely. I think in certain ways Yes and DT are much alike. They both compose such intense, powerful, mind-blowing compositions that shine with such beauty. Both of these bands are emotionally motivating and the listening experiences are rich and positive. Each album is very different from the previous one too. Obviously DT is a hell of a lot HEAVIER than Yes, but you wouldn't think so if you ever heard "Gates of Delirium" or the middle section of "Ritual". Totally insane, almost-impossible-to-perform music!!! I would just DIE to hear DT do a cover of a classic Yes song (Heart of the Sunrise, but especially Sound Chaser). I think it would probably be one of the most challenging covers DT could ever try (definitely Gates -- it is just SICK!!!) That's just my opinion, though! :) Sorry for this being such a long post, but I just felt inclined to share my Yes experience and knowledge with other Jammers. Especially to the ones who have never heard any Yes besides 90125. Buy some of their earlier works like: The Yes Album, Fragile, Close To The Edge, TFTO, Relayer. You will truly appreciate the complexity and technical skills of each member. I truly feel (stop me if I'm wrong) that both Rush AND Yes were two of DT's biggest influences. What do you think?! This isn't to exclude any other vocal metal bands that I may unaware of, but I think these bands are definite influences. I've seen Yes only once (in '94), and I look very forward to seeing them in '98 -- especially now that HOWE IS BACK!!!!! :) Thanks for reading my YesPost and as always... Take the time, Brian "T-minus 26 hours and counting..." -- DT in The Land of Izzy ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3369 **************************