YTSEJAM Digest 3356 Today's Topics: 1) Re: Voltron by Stephen Dedalus 2) Meanstreak by Brian Wherry 3) Covers by "Charlie Korch" 4) YNM debate by Chad Mitchell 5) Yankees...(non DT content!) by Chad Mitchell 6) Whereabouts of DT members.... by Bruce Dickinson 7) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3352 by Thrak75 8) Ytsejam cover version by Arash Ashouriha 9) NEVERENDING DREAMS, 5 SHOWS IN A ROW IN EUROPE (LONG!!!!!) PART 1 (fwd) by Choon-Kang Walther 10) re: DT and the Future by Brian Hansen 11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3352 by MD Polaris 12) FW show attendance by email_address_removed (Jeff Keifling) 13) Re: STOP THAT!!!! by email_address_removed 14) Re: From the pits by email_address_removed 15) Re: Guitar War by email_address_removed 16) Smack my Bitch Up! by Scott ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 10:43:30 -0800 (PST) From: Stephen Dedalus To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Voltron Message-ID: All right you bunch of pussies who like the lions. The lions suck!!!! Do you hear me? They suck!!! What kind of a real fucking robot would have little pussy lion heads as hands and feet? Everyone who's anyone knows that air team, land team, and sea team are the way to go! Shit, they even turn into three cool separate stacked vehicles. And the people were just cooler. They need to replace that sirupy-assed princess of the blue lion with someone like Sigourni Weaver or that chick from Terminater. There's a real battlin' babe! And Jeff was that much cooler than Lance, too. You people just go play with your lions. Little boys play with little toys while us big boys will play with real toys. That goes for you kick-ass tom-girls, too. Which reminds me, did anyone have that kid-sister who always got one transformer or one go-bot- or one he-man figure, just so she'd be cooler? They just don't make cool chick toys. Something must be done!!! Be well. Matt B "That is the truth. Not the hammer and sickle; not the stars and stripes; not the cross; not the sun; not gold; not yin and yang, but the smile... Because they died, we know we still live. Because a star explodes and a thousand worlds like ours die, we know this world is. That is the smile, that what might not be is." (John Fowles, The Magus) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 13:46:22 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Wherry To: email_address_removed Subject: Meanstreak Message-ID: I stumbled across this URL a bit ago: http://www-cse.ucsd.edu/users/bruss/Metal/groups/Mean.html When I saw them open for DT years ago, Marlene was playing bass and there was only one guitar player, Jmuthafuckin'P's wife Rena. :) Didn't Kevin Moore (or John Myung, maybe) thank Lisa Martens Pace in the liner notes of Awake? Wacky out ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:16:07 -0400 From: "Charlie Korch" To: email_address_removed Subject: Covers Message-ID: >>I can agree with the fact that you would like to see more of DT's songs live but common, some of the covers they do are just too incredible. As far as I'm concerned they could play just about any cover in their 'style' and I'd stand there amazed while they did it.<< Sorry that I didn't make my point clearer. I don't mind DT doing covers............I mind "Nightmare Cinema" doing covers. I go to concerts to be blown away, not to laugh. If I wanted to laugh I would go see GWAR. :o) Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 13:50:19 -0600 (CST) From: Chad Mitchell To: email_address_removed Subject: YNM debate Message-ID: >From: Bert Baldwin >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3346 >Message-ID: > >I feel that I need to disagree with Kelly about the lyrics to You Not Me..... I happen to agree with Bert. Moreover, I don't feel that this song is musically "crap" either. I find the song quite moving, the chord structure simple but tasty. Sure, it isn't as complex as "Metropolis" or some other DT classics, but I happen to like a little variety. Besides, YNM would make an excellent single, for the same reasons that PMU and BMS are, i.e., they can attract the attention of your average rock statioin listener and get them interested. There are unfortunately a ton of folk out there to whom Ozzy Osbourne and Ratt are "good music". It takes simpler stuff to penetrate the skulls of these troglodytes. How many of us found DT after hearing PMU on the radio? I did. I distincly remember hearing it a couple of times and thinking, you know, this isn't half bad. Then of course, after buying it and listening to the rest of I&W, I was floored! If continuing to produce one or twosongs such as these per album can drag in more fans, then their purpose is fulfilled. (reaches in closet for asbestos suit) Chad Mitchell Owner/GM - Oklahoma Outlaws "Doctors get to bury their mistakes, Architects can only advise their client to plant vines." -Frank Lloyd Wright ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 13:50:24 -0600 (CST) From: Chad Mitchell To: email_address_removed Subject: Yankees...(non DT content!) Message-ID: >>Btw, I am not a member of >>any NY baseball team, so I really don't understand why you are >>calling me a Yankee. :-) > >Well it's really simple mate, a 'yankee' or 'yank'is am American. Son, I'm from the South. Call *me* a "Yankee", and ah'll hafta take ye out behahnd tha woodshed and teach ya some manners. ;) Chad Mitchell Owner/GM - Oklahoma Outlaws "Doctors get to bury their mistakes, Architects can only advise their client to plant vines." -Frank Lloyd Wright ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:56:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Bruce Dickinson To: email_address_removed Subject: Whereabouts of DT members.... Message-ID: .....it is a fact that John Petrucci does not reside in New Jersey. I do not want to disclose where he lives because I know he does not want to be pestered by rude, obnoxious people. I am not indicating that any of you are, but you know the type of person I am speaking about. OK, later guys. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Matthew G. Nedell email_address_removed 1-203-256-6222 "If it's not in 2.35, I'm not watching it." Words to live by as proclaimed by James LaBrie- "I won't give up till I've no more to give, NO MORE TO GIVE!" "I said, 'I love you........................good-bye'" "So speak................I'm right here!" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:39:57 EST From: Thrak75 To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3352 Message-ID: In a message dated 12/12/97 2:31:11, you wrote: >By no means am I trying to say that Petrucci didn't put any thought into >these lyrics or that he doesn't have something he's trying to say. I'm >quite sure that's not true in this case. I'm just saying I wouldn't try to >attribute any gifted insights into the lyrics of anyone's music even if >they are my all-time favorite band. After all, it's a business. Bands >have schedules, contracts, media pressures, etc. that can sometimes effect >what they produce. this comment may depict the most interesting and probably most fair or accurate assessment of dream theater lyrics. ytsegoon ************************************************************************ david y. kobayashi the new york law school email_address_removed email_address_removed "i'm the monster you created in your daddy's name." - j. petrucci ************************************************************************ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 21:11:03 -0800 From: Arash Ashouriha To: email_address_removed Subject: Ytsejam cover version Message-ID: Hi Has anybody heared a band called "MADSWORD" from Italy ? They have coverd "YTSEJAM" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Their version is a lot heavier and without keyboards. I think it's not bad. Anyone else has heard this cover version ? Btw, some people have problems with my weekly top 10 albums. Why ? I mean, some people mailed what they have dreamed last night and nobody has something against it, which is absolutely ok. Any my top 10 ? I think it's a good idea to show others, what I've heard last week. Maybe they are some artists they don't know, so maybe they will get in to them. Like Royal Hunt ! Arash -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | PROG OR DIE - The Progressive Music Page | | | | DREAM THEATER - FATES WARNING - ROYAL HUNT - SHADOW GALLERY | | | | http://lionel.kr.fh-niederrhein.de/~ashouria/index.htm | | OR | | http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Venue/1748/ | | | | by Arash Ashouriha | | | | email_address_removed.de | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 21:47:46 +0100 (CET) From: Choon-Kang Walther To: MakTs , Vito Staedler , Subject: NEVERENDING DREAMS, 5 SHOWS IN A ROW IN EUROPE (LONG!!!!!) PART 1 (fwd) Message-ID: Hi Jammers, I'm a 23 years old Jammer from Switzerland and just got back from one of the most thrilling adventures in my entire life. I'm kinda dissapointed from the European Jammers. I thought there would be more reviews on the jam, this doesn't include people from the UK. For everyone interested, I will add setlists of three shows at the end of my story. I've started of preparing the trip about 5 weeks before the onset of the tour: get tickets to every show = find people who buy them for me, get accomodation and information about the concertplaces, find the cheapest train ticket. Travel day 1 ------------ The adventure begins with a tiring 10 hour trip, 8 of which on the same spot in the same train, to Holland. I don't want to attend the show in Offenbach, Germany, because of the local policy in selling merchandise. The band's merchandiser is not allowed to sell, instead he's replaced by local hands and the hall official raises a 20% sales tax!!! Instead I visit John WGMTT (who got me the ticket). We spend very entertaining hours throwing (prog) band names at each other, discussing the Jam (quote John:'those 25 people mailing and the other 800 watching'), doing the Quiz (Max Arbot's homepage, more about it later) and preparing mentally for the gig with bootlegs and the Japan video. Travel day 2 ------------ John, his friend Robert and I reach after minor problems (a complete empty car battery, onset of rush hour) Den Bosch where they become aware of something missing: Their tickets! They drop me at the hotel and call up the hall which apparently is sold out. Back they go. At least 3 hours to drive and two hours till Vanden Plas start. I give Dave a ring, a local fan from Den Bosch, who offers to pick me up at the hotel. He just arrives when I get a call from Matt, Pensylvania. He'd decided about 2 weeks before the leave to join me, even though he's not that much of a DT fan. (compare to Ties' report from dec. 9th) Dave is grateful and also picks up Matt from the station who's been awake some 30 (!) hours by that time. After a snack we finally get to the hall were I manage to smuggle in my camera for the 1st time. (I have to say that it's a pretty big SLR camera, with a 28-80 mm and a 70-210mm zoom objcectiv equipped!) Den Bosch --------- I meet jammer Laurens and am stared at like the 8th miracle of the Antique by his friends. 'You're from Switzerland?!' untill I introduce Matt. Laurens told me that his sister Sound: quite loud, first thing I notice, brilliant, second impression. Fortunately James is quite healthy, I've already been afraid by the cold he's had at the onset of the US dates. Crowd: pretty loud shouting, kinda hard to get in the front row. Extras: I have to revise my image of the smoking Dutch. There are more weed-warshippers in Switzerland than in Holland!!!! I smoke with two guys who than lift me upon their shoulders and carry me along the stage while shouting 'Take pictures!' Hall: It is a sports hall, with a balcony around the whole of the interior. One gets actually to sit behind the stagefront and to watch the guys from the side and from behind. The capacity is, I've been told, 4000 people, allowed 2800. After the show: Matt goes to sleep. I pick up a bootleg sweatshirt. I know, it's not the fairest behaviour towards the band, but this one is really nice: grey hood, grey inserts in the sleves, flaming heart and FII pic displayed, and I haven't seen sold at any shows after. Dave, his folks and I amuse us listening to the 'Dream Out Loud' bootleg, probably James at his worst, (Sorry James, but I can't deny it at least some entertaining qualities.) while starting yet another homepage. Travel day 3 ------------ Never let an American use a European shower without expaining it to him. (Might lead to another flood.) Matt and I get to Bonn with some delay. Someone has commited suicide, abusing a train and now the train is concealed by states authorities; can't have been a dissapointed DT-fan, though. At the hall, we meet Michael (who's got 72 DT-CDs at home, does anyone still call me mad with my photography-obsession?) and one of these 25 people on the Jam: Arash, WGMTT. (Jez, what a cutie!) I've asked the night before what the name of the tour manager is and the second person I'm aproaching happens to be him. I explain with my sweetest voice that I'm from Switzerland, doing 4 shows (I show the tickets for proof) and my friend is even from the US! (not necessary to mention that he's already getting fed up with DT-shows...) I ask about a chance to meet 'The Band' personally and am told that there would be two aftershow passes at the entrance. CHRISTMAS AND MY BIRTHDAY ON THE SAME DAY, especially because there really are two passes!!! Bonn ---- I walk in (with company: my camera) and get trough to the front row. The local security threaten me already after the 2nd song of Vandan Plas to either take my camera or give the film. The last time I take pics from the front row, stupid me. Actually they are quite nice guys. They entertain us about their stressing jobs at 'Spice Girls' and 'Boy Groups' concerts with rows of girls passing out and in the end I get even the film back. Sound: Crisp, good quality. Since I concentrate this night on the band, I finally realize the swift and very slight changes DT make on their songs, besides of changing the running order every night even if it includes the same songs. Play a tact twice instead of once, the guitar going up instead of down for two seconds, an additional layer of keyboard, a minute of very simple bass-drum rythm and an improvised guitar across, and just TIGHT, NO HOLE IN THE SOUND ! Crowd: Easy, very comfortable to stand, enough air, half the hall singing along! Extras: I scream all the lyrics with two girls next to me. We point out Dereks posing and once start shouting 'Derek' which enlightens his face with yet another smile. Arash just stares in astonishment at the band. DT put parts of the Mirror and an old Rainbow song into the Ytsejam and the extra, Metropolis, ends with drums still being played but Mike already calsping peoples hads: roadie-support. Hall: It looks rather like a club than like a sports hall, my guess is close to 2000 people. The hall is part of a huge complex, which also includes a public work out area, bureau rooms, working facilities... Aftershow Matt and I am waiting for the dudes to appear. First is Derek who walkes straight up to a table with two blond girls and starts conversation. I give him the choccolate which I bring along to most of the concerts I attend, after all I'm from Switzerland and I've never had anybody turn this present down. Sorry to interrupt, but the working room at the University closes now and I gotta leave. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 13:02:26 -0800 From: Brian Hansen To: email_address_removed Subject: re: DT and the Future Message-ID: Good Post Bruce. > From: "Bruce D. Duesterhoeft" > >I was just thinking the way to work today about DT's future (you do >things like this during an hour drive). Now, I'm almost sure that Mike >has said that the direction the band is going in is the way THEY want to >go. I kind of question this. You have to remember that "THEY" are a band. The individuals may want to go different directions. So when we hear one member talk, they probably aren't talking for the whole band. (Kevin Moore obviously wanted to go in a different direction.) What we hear when the recording is done is probably some sort of compromise. (O.K. We can do the Journey-style chorus, but it has to be 12 minutes long with 15 time changes. Oh yeah, we have to have one radio song too.) > From Rush to > Metallica to Queensryche and so on. I agree, I think that DT is starting to follow the pattern, whatever that is. >What I think bands like Dream Theater and the like should do is, forget >what is going on in the 'commercial world', but do what you want and TRY .. >Why doesn't DT try to step up and do what they stand for, instead of >making their music 'more accessible'. I say BULL SHIT! Americans Once again, I agree. It's always a red flag to me when a band (or band member), starts to talk about trying to mold themselves to fit some market. Or are trying to be like this or that. On the other hand, a good sign for me is when a band says that they just started coming up with some incredible ideas and rolled from there. No thought to market positioning or accessibility. They just put out their music and say to the world, check this out! But then again, as others have said, in the real world you can be a starving artist, or you can try to make some money. Metallica may have lost their edge and their artistic integrity, but I bet they're rolling in the dough! Plus my guess is that the music is a lot easier to write than something like MoP or AJFA. Being a starving artist starts to lose it's appeal when you get older, married and have kids. hasta, BH ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 15:53:24 EST From: MD Polaris To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3352 Message-ID: In a message dated 97-12-12 07:02:33 EST, you write: << > What does it say that Def Leppard's drummer uses one hand less then he used > to, and it's not enough of a difference that they need to fire him? You know, I like Def Leppard's 80's stuff, but I recently heard some of their early work (when they were part of "the new wave of british heavy metal") and man, they freakin' rocked. Fast, heavy, cool. -Brian >> their first album, On Through the Night, is incredible...it's fast, heavy, and raw...if you like Def Leppard at all you sould give the album a listen...unfortunately their last album, SLANG sucks...it's basically alternative...but i like the rest of them. Mike ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 16:31:29 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Jeff Keifling) To: email_address_removed Subject: FW show attendance Message-ID: >>APSOG is a pretty quiet, contemplative song at times, and >>it could be absolutely ruined by a bunch of people making a lot of noise >>during the quiet parts. How's the noise level been so far? Quiet. We just stood there with our jaws on the floor. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:29:52 -0700 (MST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: STOP THAT!!!! Message-ID: > I wish DT stopped playing covers, and would treat us to one more great DT > song. Remember, every goofy Nightmare Cinema spoof is one less Scarred we > get to see. C'Mon DT, play Scarred!!!!! Nah, I disagree here, it's a show I'm going to see. It'd be MUCH more entertaining to experience the Nightmare Cinema act and doing a cover tune here or there than DT just do DT. Granted, I'd love to hear as much DT live as possible (hence, my bootleg collection) but the dudes need to have some sort of fun! heh heh Why don't they just extend their act? Hell, Fates Warning played the Mason Jar, here in Phoenix until 1:30 in the morning. It pissed off the owner, but the crowd LOVED every minute of it. ('sides, the owner wasn't into the music at all, and he's an asshole too) ~Eckie, still waiting for an AZ date to pop up in the DT tour schedule ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:33:29 -0700 (MST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: From the pits Message-ID: > "Uh, if it's so lame...why is it selling out so fast?" > > -that is not a very good defense. Look at what else sells. Yeah, but it works in reverse logic from the other "stuff" that sells. You see, stuff that truly sucks, like Bjork, Spice Girls, and Puff Daddy, Missy Elliot etc., will sell millions. Stuff that kicks ass but is said to be sucky won't sell anything at all. See what I'm sayin'? >;) ~Eckie and his fucked up logic ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 14:34:51 -0700 (MST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Guitar War Message-ID: Yeah, it's me again, On Thu, 11 Dec 1997, ProgRckBoy wrote: > I'm the same. It seems that if you write something that sounds good clean, > you can arrange the parts to add a distorted guitar... but if you write > things dirty, then you have a lot of cleaning to do. And you don't need an > amp for an acoustic. I HIGHLY doubt Mirror/Lie was written on an accoustic! ~Won't Eckie stop posting?! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 13:36:11 -0800 (PST) From: Scott To: email_address_removed Subject: Smack my Bitch Up! Message-ID: >If Rush has "cycled toward commercialism", then why is it that the much >of the Rush I hear is from 1982 (ie: Signals) and earlier? Wouldn't their >newer material get more airplay if it was more commercial? Aside from the >occasional "Test For Echo" (when the album was first released) and the >_one_ time I heard "Ghost of a Chance," where is this fabled >commercialism? Progressive rock doesn't (just) mean 20 minute songs about >otherwordly forces (2112) and allegorical quests for meaning (The >Fountain of Lamneth). I firmly believe that Rush is writing and playing >the kind of music that they want to write. And if you can listen to anything Rush put out AFTER Hemispheres and say they didn't go commercial then you're either not paying attention or have an IQ of a turnip! They went from writing some of the greatest rock songs of all time, prog or not, to becoming a Human League/Eurythmics clone in the 80's. That shit from Signals all the way through Hold Your Fire is all synth pop. I'm not saying it's all bad, but most of it sucks (sorry Merlo, it had to be said ;-) ). It wasn't until Presto that they started getting back more towards guitar oriented music and stopped trying to get airplay in the discos. >I've got a pantheon of animals in a pagan soul >Vishnu and Gaia - Aztec and Maya >Dance around my totem pole > >That's commercial? I think that's quite far removed from "So....tell me >what you want what you really really want." Lyrics aren't what make a song commercially viable, it's the beat. If you can dance to it and have a marketable look then you can have your :15. >I have this idea.....I know it has probably been thought of before but it >would be cool. DT should remix WDaDU and have the vibrant James LaBrie >perform the vocals. I am almost positive the members of DT would not be >up for it but it sure would be cool. I guess a live bootleg could be made >up of the songs in the order of WDaDU. Hey, if anyone else is with me >please let me know. Not a bad idea but LaBrie's fucking ego gets in the way. This guy is one of the biggest assholes in rock and roll and when I heard how he intimidated a jammer one time for wearing a ytsejam shirt (this was before James understood what this whole list thing was) I lost all respect for the bunghole. It's one thing to try to stop bootleggers from profiting on your name, but to have a woman talk you into coming to meet James and when he does he starts threatening you for the shirt you're wearing tha shows me the guy has no class. Why do you think they don't play WDADU songs in concert anymore (except for Ytsejam)? It's because James is such a fucking baby he can't handle singing songs from another singer. Now excuse me while I go smack my bitch up. Scott ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3356 **************************