YTSEJAM Digest 3317 Today's Topics: 1) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3311 by Chris Groves 2) Re: Guitars.... by CLARK ABEL 3) Re: prog cliches by "Vincent G. LuPone" 4) Re: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: YTSEJAM digest 3310 by Matt Johnston 5) Re: WDaDU :One Way (and other ramblings) by email_address_removed 6) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3312 by Einstein H Zappa 7) Tampa, FL show by Bobby Tufino 8) Prog cliches ... concept albums by Einstein H Zappa 9) RE: YTSEJAM digest 3314 by "Trevor W. Hoit" 10) Re: Thanksgiving myth by Anna & Heike Boedeker 11) Re: Guitars.... by Anna & Heike Boedeker 12) QUEENSRYCHE & SILENT MAN CD SINGLE (EUROPE) by Steve.Arthur@Thameswater.CO.UK 13) Various replies by email_address_removed (Jeff Keifling) 14) re: X-giving by Syrinx 15) RE: DT Tape for email_address_removed by AL 16) Surfage by Jon Parmet ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 17:06:02 +1000 From: Chris Groves To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3311 Message-ID: >Last night I saw a song from Faith no More on that 12 angry viewers >show (yes I watch it sometimes....it is one of the few places you can >hear new music), anyways, they played a song from FNM with the word >Ashes in the title. I was wondering if anyone has the "Album of the >year", and what they thought of it. I really liked the song, and to >interest me more, all of the morons on the show hated it. Well, being a loyal Faith No More fan, I guess I have to answer this. 'Album Of The Year', to me, is GREAT. Ask any Faith No More fan, and more than likely all they'll tell you is "it's not _Angel Dust_". Fine, but as an album on its own merits, it's fucking fantastic. If you liked 'Ashes To Ashes', chances are, you'll like the rest of the album heaps, too, although 'Ashes To Ashes' is fairly slow and (not the right word, but.....) 'moodier' than the rest of the CD for the most part. AOTY is also a bit short for my liking (only around 45 minutes), and has a couple of bum songs (the most obvious being 'Home Sick Home'), but it still kicks ass, and 'Stripsearch' has to be one of the best songs released this year. It's the new single in Europe/Australasia, so maybe the USA will get it eventually. ANYWAY, buy AOTY, if you thought Ashes To Ashes was great, more than likely you will like the rest of the CD. Seeya! Chris Groves. email_address_removed.au ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 01:14:04 -0500 (EST) From: CLARK ABEL To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Guitars.... Message-ID: Here's my quick thoughts on the guy who's looking to buy a guitar. As far as the acoustic vs. electric question goes: I honestly don't think there's any advantage to starting out on acoustic, unless that's what you want to play. I think the reasoning behind this is that since acoustics have heavier strings and generally higher action (the height of the strings from the fretboard), you will supposedly build up more finger strength this way. And in a sense it's true, an electric is "easier" to play. But if you're not interested in much accoustic guitar music, don't waste your money on an accoustic guitar. If you practice the right things and you practice properly, it doesn't matter which you learn on. If you want to become a good electric guitar, play an electric guitar. If, later on, you decide you want to play accoustic, it's not that damn hard to pick that up and learn it. It's not like if you learn on electric first, you're doomed to never be able to play an accoustic. Buy what you want to play. Oh, and yes, you have more versatility in terms of different sounds with an electric, but no, you definitely can't get it to sound like an accoustic, especially not if you're just buying a relatively cheap guitar and especially a relatively cheap amp. You can play the accoustic stuff on the clean channel of your amp, and it will sound OK, but not really all that much like an accoustic. As far as brands and prices... well, the best thing you can do is to take someone who knows about guitars with you. And I think you might want to try someone other than the friend who told you to start on accoustic. Of course I don't know, but he doesn't sound too open-minded. Every guitar is different, even the exact same model by the exact same company varies from one unit to the next... it's a tree, after all. So the point is, you can find a really great sounding guitar for pretty cheap if you look hard enough and if you get lucky. Buying a used guitar can be a good option, too, buy but you definitel want to have someone who knows what they're doing so you don't buy a used guitar with problems. A damaged neck or other structural problems can be hard to spot at first, but make the guitar useless later. I could also give you my spiel about not buying some cheaply make, over-priced "vintage" guitar, but I'm trying to be objective here. :) -Clark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 23:21:07 -0700 From: "Vincent G. LuPone" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: prog cliches Message-ID: At 09:59 PM 12/3/97 -0800, Rob wrote: > >Can anyone say black clothes? heheh, no,, that's a METAL cliche :) A few friends of mine and I have come up with a theory for this. First off, black makes you look like a badass, and hey, it hides the beer and blood stains :) . .-/ \ _.-~ / \___ ______ __ _ \ / -~|| __||_ __// || | / . . || __| | |\ / ' || |__ / / ~| ||____| |_| /_/|_||____| / / |-~\ \ \ \ | || || | / /__ / \ \____\|\_\|_/|_||____| WILL NEVER DIE. / .-~\ \-~ /.-~ \ /~ .- \ .-~ ~Vince \.-~ If you don't like it, it won't hurt my feelings. :) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 22:38:01 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Johnston To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: YTSEJAM digest 3310 Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Dec 1997 email_address_removed.au wrote: >The word 'please & thank you' go a long way on this list :) They must be still going a long way from the last time they were used -- this is the first time I've seen either since I joined ^_^ > >email_address_removed >asdf > >unsubscribe ytsejam > >try to have a nice day with the ytsejam :) > >graham > > > --Matt --------------------------------------------------------------------- "..." --James LaBrie, "Hell's Kitchen" --------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 01:44:05 -0500 (EST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: WDaDU :One Way (and other ramblings) Message-ID: I originally had the "One Way" release of the disc, and then one day I ran across a French import of WDaDU disc, on Mechanic Records, used, for 6 bucks! So what the hell right? The packaging is worth the money, and I get to see the perms, and Charile's dumb-ass smile, up close! :-) As for sound quality, the only difference I hear between the 2 is that the Mechanic version seems to be slightly louder. They really oughta standardize the volume at which a CD is mastered, because I hate when you have the CD player on "Random" and the volume drops drastically from CD to CD. See ya at the Roxy! (BTW, any pre show gatherings?) Art ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 02:08:34 -0500 (EST) From: Einstein H Zappa To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3312 Message-ID: > >note and at the same time hum the 10th through the instrument (the 3rd up an > >octave), the combination will produce the 5th in addition. One wind > >instrument player playing a major chord. Fun to do. It's worked for me on > >trombone and flute. > That's intriguing. Does it work for woodwinds? I don't suppose if you The flute isn't a brass instrument. As long as you can hum at the same time you're blowing, it should work. > flat the 3rd (or 10th in this case) you could still get the fifth, > producing the minor chord? Now that would be cool. Nope, sorry. It's a very specific wave interference-thing. [ There has only been one thing in my life worth living for, [ So it would take a true genius to fuck it up. [ Call me Einstein Hawkings Tolkien Heraclitus Darwin PKD Zappa. [ (http://www.afn.org/~afn39111) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 02:13:16 -0500 From: Bobby Tufino To: email_address_removed Subject: Tampa, FL show Message-ID: Jammers: Maybe this has been posted, I don't know, but just in case: The Dec. 17th Tampa, FL show is NOT at the Ritz. It is at a place called the Masquerade (yes, I am positive), and is located in downtown Ybor City which I guess is part of Tampa. They are on sale at TicketBastard, and I am told they are giving away a signed guitar at the show. Laters, all... Bobby (dripping with the ooze and slime of the heaving earth...) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 02:55:35 -0500 (EST) From: Einstein H Zappa To: email_address_removed Subject: Prog cliches ... concept albums Message-ID: Indeed you are right, person who thinks QR's O:M and Marillion's Brave and Misplaced Childhood are the best concept albums out there. In fact, I put O:M and MC on my top 5 albums ever list. But then I have a hard time coming up with a concept album that I don't like a WHOLE LOT, if I like the music. Maybe Genesis's Lamb Lies Down, just because Gabriel was a VERY WEIRD guy back then. But APSOG, pure magic. Saga's _Generation 13,_ very good and pretty consistent. Tales from Topographic Oceans ... a lot of people don't like this album, but I love it. Joe's Garage ... iffy, but still a classic. I think every concept album I own is a significant step above most of the rest of my collection. In summary: concept albums, don't slag em. [ There has only been one thing in my life worth living for, [ So it would take a true genius to fuck it up. [ Call me Einstein Hawkings Tolkien Heraclitus Darwin PKD Zappa. [ (http://www.afn.org/~afn39111) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 01:03:10 -0800 From: "Trevor W. Hoit" To: "'email_address_removed'" Subject: RE: YTSEJAM digest 3314 Message-ID: >From: Kevin Madden >Subject: One more way Bahr could be a hero >He could send me my King's X cd, for one. I sent him >private e-mail, and received no answer. I guess he was >too busy saving the world ;-0 -------------------------------------------------- Kev, Welcome to the boat. Grab a paddle. Trevor > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 11:43:34 +0100 From: Anna & Heike Boedeker To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Thanksgiving myth Message-ID: .. Brian Hayden ... >Let's state the facts here. The English, unlike the Spanish, Portugese, etc., >didn't just come over here and start slaughtering people. They coexisted with >Native Americans for a time. They eventually became caught in the middle of >various inter-tribal wars and suffered greatly at the hands of various tribes, >which spawned the tragic "Indian policies" of the British, and later the >American, government. Well, not quite... in the 16th century it still "only" was about fur-trade, which, however, lead to conflicts between what you call "tribes" b/c now some tried to expand their hunting-grounds... also traders introduced diseases... Trade also corrupted traditional social structures like the division of labour between genders as men more and more specialized on hunting "fur animals" and trade. Sure, you can follow the strategy of "blaming the victim" here, as it indeed were "inter-tribal wars", but w/out traders having tried to exploit them as fur-hunters this probably never had happened. You also should be aware of the fact that some "tribes" refused to participate in fur-trading, but these were defamed as especially cruel since they killed intruders who "only" were after "fur animals", when in fact they only had learned their bitter lesson... In the 17th century fur-trade moved westward and on the coast (New England and around Chesapeake Bay) traders were replaced by colonists. Whereas traders had an interest in a peaceful coexistance (problematic as this had been anyway, see above) w/ Natives, settlers wanted to *buy* land from them -- an idea which was simply way too strange to them. What they did was offer them land *temporarily* as was common practise amongst themselves. The colonists misunderstood this profoundly and felt betrayed themselves which led to conflicts and finally waging war against Natives. But again, would you call this just a tragic misunderstanding?? Understanding is not a one-way-street... if it's asymmetrical like this it's simply overpowering... instead it requires mutual efforts... up to the day... Kianniayi, Heike (sorry for the NDTC but I think we should get this straight) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 10:15:27 +0100 From: Anna & Heike Boedeker To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Guitars.... Message-ID: .. Mohamed Gaffoor ... >some other insturments like piano and sax. Anyway, my friend insists >that to really learn to play well I should first learn on an acoustic. >However, he says that it's easier to learn on an electric and that while >that option is tempting it's better to start with the acoustic. Another >friend of mine just bought an electric and is learning and says that >you're much better off with the electric since you can always make the >electric have and acoustic sound so the electric is more versatile. So Yeah, you can use additional piezo PUs mounted into the bridge resp. saddles (I've not yet found a convincing solution to do this w/ a Floyd Rose, though)... but this is more an "acoustic-electric" genre of its own, and real nice "hybrid" guitars like Parker or Godin are not for everyone (though I for one like them). But nothing of all this feels like a "real" acoustic. >lemme ask you guys, which is better to first learn on, electric or Ha ha... this is more of an ideological debate... 20 years ago everyone recommended to start w/ an acoustic b/c they themselves had done so... What in fact happened was that a bunch of guys bought cheap acoustics, typical beginners' guitars, which they only wanted to get rid of after a few weeks only to buy something they really liked like back then over here mostly something like an Ibanez Silver Series Strat (Fenders mostly were crappy and unaffordable back then), Ibanez Musician or even a Guild... These days consequently more guys recommend starting w/an electric... except they are into projective "self"-punishment in which case they will "advice" "you" to start w/ a Classical guitar :-) The thing simply is if *you* *want* to play electric, then get an electric, if you want an acoustic, then get an acoustic, if you want to have both, then do get both... >acoustic? Also, what is a good price to play for a new guitar (either >electric or acoustic) for a beginner. Also, what's a good brand of guitar >(either electric or acoustic) to learn on? You're living in the US, right? Unlike the situation in Europe many shops carry quite a bunch of 2nd hand guitars (and amps, too) not only for vintage freaks, so that you can walk out the store w/something really good and still have something to eat for the rest of the month. It more depends on which kind of guitar you'd like to have then, but e.g. Gibson SGs and 80s style metal axes (beefed-up Strat w/high-output humbuckers and a Floyd Rose or equivalently good Whammy, no matter whether Ibanez, Hamer, ESP, Charvel/Jackson, yada) are more than just common... 'acourse here are different philosophies at work, too, some people will advice you to invest not too much for *beginners* stuff, but if you already have managed to learn to play other instruments I'd be more confident, and besides also to a beginner it's more fun to have something one really enjoys instead of looking forward to the day one will resell it... Just check out quite a bunch of stuff and don't be shy to bother the guys at the shop b/c after all it's their job, and they want to sell it! You will quickly be able to determine what you get for which amount of money, like getting a feeling when you check out one for $400 and one for $700 the latter somehow might be better (or not...) but in the end you don't feel like it justified the extra expense. Have fun!! Heike ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 10:56:44 +0000 From: Steve.Arthur@Thameswater.CO.UK To: email_address_removed Subject: QUEENSRYCHE & SILENT MAN CD SINGLE (EUROPE) Message-ID: <80256563.003B6256.00@ThamesWater.Co.Uk> Hey, Thanks to those who responded to my queries about Savatage and TSO, I didn't get any feedback on Fates Warning, their style and total absence from CD racks in british shops. ARE THEY WORTH SEEKING OUT?? Also I'm intrigued by some of the responses about Q'ryche and especially Promised Land. Now I've been a QR fan for nearly 10 years but felt let down by Promised Land after Empire (Another Rainy Night Without You .............YEAH). Sure Promised Land showed some neat moves like Disconnected, title track and Damaged but tracks like Lady Jane and My Global Mind were real anti-climaxes. However I will admit that HitNF could be a couple of tracks shorter (Anytime/Anywhere...Hit the Black) This is purely a fan's constructive criticism which I hope will see some structured and considered replies. Remember I love this band and DT so I must have most of my marbles.............. PS Is the Silent Man CD single a rarity in UK or Europe in general...I've just ordered it from Virgin I tried to order a bulk supply of Lie Singles after the great response to the sale of my one copy...but I'm still awaiting to hear from various outlets........... Steve ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 06:19:59 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Jeff Keifling) To: email_address_removed Subject: Various replies Message-ID: >> If they re-released it, would it also have the copyright year of >> its re-release? The copyright on it says 1989, if I'm not >> mistaken............ That's how copyrights work - the year it was written / recorded. >>Prog-metal cliches is a thread I've wanted to start for a while. How 'bout rhyming pain with rain? >>Here... I'm gonna piss some Savatage fans off: I loved Tage for a >>long time... then HoR came out, and after listening to the album >>several times, I've decided that "Taunting Cobras" is such a bad >>song, that it's actually caused me to like all of music less. Doesn't piss me off. I love the music of Savatage, and I just choose to skip that song cause I don't like it either. Even though I wonder what the hell they were thinking when they wrote that song, I don't think any less of their others. Matter of fact, I had bought the single and missed out on the next two albums for two years because of it. >>Anyway, my friend insists >> that to really learn to play well I should first learn on an acoustic. >> says that you're much better off with the electric since you can always >>make the >>electric have and acoustic sound Sound doesn't have anything to do with learning to play (in the beginning). That comes later. I learned on acoustic, which is good cause the strings are tighter and much harder to press down, which builds calises faster and gets you some good practice, and makes going to an electric a piece of cake. The problem I have with the electric though is that the strings are too close together. I say get a used acoustic for $50 and learn all your chords and scales really good and then go electric if you then want to. But I draw for a living so don't take this as professional advice. -Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 07:22:29 -0500 (EST) From: Syrinx To: Pat Sullivan Subject: re: X-giving Message-ID: > >> It means we get together with our families, eat turkeys, and > >> watch (American) football. Or something like that. :) > > > > Isn't that what Christmas is all about? :-) > > No, at Christmas we eat ham. :) "no, not ham, you fat fuck!" "christmas is about something way more important." "what?" "presents." * * * * * * * * e-mail: email_address_removed / email_address_removed erotomania!: http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx/ offical lemur voice homepage: http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx/lemur.htm maintainer of the genesis frequently asked questions list: http://www.mindspring.com/~syrinx/genesis/genesis-faq.htm (c) 1997 Erotomania, Inc. All Rights Reserved. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 07:24:23 -0600 From: AL To: YTSE Jammers 880480531 Subject: RE: DT Tape for email_address_removed Message-ID: I don't know what your friend's music listening habits are, but this should be a good representation of the broad range of DT. Best of all, it fits onto a 90 minute tape with a minimal amount of slack space. Be careful cueing side 2, it's a little tight depending on the cassette manufacturer. Side 1 Trail Of Tears (FII) 13:07 Hell's Kitchen (FII) 4:16 Lines In The Sand (FII) 12:05 Learning To Live (IAW) 11:30 The Silent Man (Awake) 3:48 Running Time 44:46 Side 2 Scarred (Awake) 11:00 Metropolis (IAW) 9:30 Take Away My Pain (FII) 6:03 Lifting Shadows Off A Dream (Awake) 6:05 Just Let Me Breathe (FII) 5:28 Another Day (IAW) 4:22 Wait For Sleep (IAW) 2:31 Running Time 44:59 I hope this helps. See ya, AL... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 14:45:09 +0000 From: Jon Parmet To: Ytsejam Subject: Surfage Message-ID: Surf over to http://www.cddb.com, click on "CDDB Search Engine" and search for "Dream Theater". Some interesting results. And of course, there are 4 entries returned if you search for "Dream Theatre", but at least the former returns more :) Regards, Jon -- *------------*----------------------------*--------------* | Jon Parmet | email_address_removed | 617-494-2851 | *------------*----------------------------*--------------* "The Apollo Guidance Computer was primitive by any modern comparison having but 72 kilobytes of ROM and 4 kilobytes of RAM" ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3317 **************************