YTSEJAM Digest 3248 Today's Topics: 1) Chris, Kevin, Screwdrivers, Met Part I, and a tiny bit o'DTC by "Blevins, Mike" 2) New Ozzy: NDTC by Jeremy Kube 3) Re: Metropolis - Part 1 and 2 by Eric Rodger 4) UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: I beg your pardon? by email_address_removed.au 5) drummers by email_address_removed (Dr. Mosh) 6) UNCLASSIFIED:-My Apologies by email_address_removed.au 7) HY... by "Michael J. Emerson" 8) Don't start flame wars, you'll scare mike! by Seroussi 9) Front row, Symphony X, Angra by Phil Carter 10) Where Are You Now ? by Arash Ashouriha 11) thanks for information ! by Arash Ashouriha 12) Re: drummers by email_address_removed 13) Re: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: I beg your pardon? by email_address_removed 14) Re: Metropolis - Part 1 and 2 by email_address_removed ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 15:24:19 -0500 From: "Blevins, Mike" To: "'email_address_removed'" Subject: Chris, Kevin, Screwdrivers, Met Part I, and a tiny bit o'DTC Message-ID: Kevin "Go Wings" Madden wrote... >Mr. Ptacek claimed he didn't hear the similarities between Symphony >X's singer and Dio. This I cannot understand. If you have ever listened >to a Rainbow cd (and if you haven't, you should), it should be quite >obvious. Symphony X sounds like Yngwie, Dio, Queen and Rainbow run >through the blender, in my opinion. Maybe if you only have listened >to modern-day Dio it isn't as obvious, but that stuff from his Rainbow >years is very similar. Oh well. I agree. Symphony X _IS_ the modern day embodiment of Rainbow, IMO. Rick "Mr. Dolby" Audet wrote... >Here's the deal. Poor Mr. Ptacek had a screwdriver jammed into his hear by >that luthier who set Chris straight about the usefulness of a scalloped >fretboard. Ever since then, he's been listening to music with his other >ear....the same ear that is deaf from Maddy yellinging into it all the time >"Chris, quit playing Ron Thal on iParty and come to dinner!!" > >Or something. :) You know, that would explain a great deal... :) Ryan wrote... >I was just thinking today, and I think it'd be really cool if, on the >Metropolis Part 2 release, that DT would re-record Metropolis Pt. 1 and put >it on the disc, then you could kind of flow from the first to the second. >Not to mention it would get rid of that snare. =) What does everybody >think about this one? Just as long as they didn't get the snare sound from BMS or ACOS. Ugh. Did I mention I STILL don't like the production on FII? :) BTW, "Metropolis" came on right as I read this. Pretty odd, huh? Mike I feel like a .sig today... Division - Vicious Rumors, Powermad 97, and Fates and DR again. It's gonna be a busy month... http://www.crosslink.net/~division or human email email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 15:26:43 -0500 From: Jeremy Kube To: email_address_removed Subject: New Ozzy: NDTC Message-ID: Has anyone heard when the release date of the new Ozzy album "The Ozzman Commeth"? I would like to know because I plan on getting it... Has anyone heard it yet? Is it worth getting? Let me know if you have... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:05:46 -0500 From: Eric Rodger To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Metropolis - Part 1 and 2 Message-ID: Chris said: > First off, my good man, relax. It is my opinion, and I merely >expressed myself. Just because I disagree with you, doesn't mean you >have to freak out. I was completely relaxed and wasn't freaking out. I'm not sure what in the text would have given you that impression, but it was an incorrect inference. I also don't mind when someone disagrees with me, but I get the impression that you think otherwise of me. Like you, what I stated was all just my opinion, and I was/am simply stirring up some ideas with you. I don't NEED to be right, just need some good conversation. > Now, Metropolis 2 is the sequel to Metropolis 1, right? Right. >Not the next album, as Awake was to Images and Words, but the sequel >to the song. Since the band has changed dramtically over the years, >and since they themselves have expressed some distaste for the >triggered snare sound a while back, it seems like a novel idea to >re-record the song to capture the new sound of Dream Theater. I just don't like the idea. I see absolutely no need to re-record a song that I feel is perfect on I&W. I've already heard Derek play it live, and it wasn't a drastic enough change/improvement/progression to warrant a re-recording of it, IMO. Possibly from a marketing point of view, it might be a good idea to throw it on with Met 2, but then again, maybe not. I'm not sure which method would stimulate more sales, but other than from a possible sales standpoint, I see no reason to include it. > As I said before, Eric, I put strict qualifications on how I thought >it would make sense to do this. Go back and read my post. See the >"If and only if" part? I don't believe that the cd which contains >Metropolis 2 will be a full album. They've mentioned doing it as an >EP. True, but ACOS is also an EP, and it's the length of most artists' full length LPs. But regardless of whether the Met 2 CD is 45 min or 78 min, I'd rather have 2 of the FII leftovers on it, than Metropolis part 1 again. JMO. > I also mentioned in my post that we know we're not going to miss >any of the music. It will all be released. But I don't think you >read that... I think you just saw "He disagrees with me!!!" Wrong. I read all of your post. You're assuming I didn't read the parts that I didn't address. I disagree that all of the music will necessarily be released this time. Granted, up until now, every song has pretty much been available to us, even if only on a single. I don't believe that will be true now. There's simply too much material, and at the pace they are writing, I think some will get left in the cold. Mike clearly stated about one song "That is the 'Don't Look Past Me' of the bunch," indicating that it probably would not be recorded or released. What I'm saying is that I'd rather have that song on the Met 2 CD, than Met 1 again. > Now stop and realize, I want all of the new material as badly as you >do. I merely don't believe that the recording process is so finite. >They could record Metropolis 1 in one take by now. Just because they >would have an extra song on a cd, doesn't mean you'll never hear the >rest of the stuff. You need to relax and realize that what we say >has no impact on what happens... it's merely the expression of our >ideas on what we think would be cool. I agree, and again, I am relaxed. > You'll get your other 90 minutes of music, dude. The fact that they >have so much already written just means that you'll probably get it >all that much sooner. I doubt it. I'm convinced that some material is going to get the shaft this time. I hope I'm wrong. The fact that DT writes material quickly does not mean that we'll get it as quickly (take FII for example). It just means that while the record company is dragging their feet on the next release, they'll be writing more and more material. Inevitably, some of the material will be passed over. I don't think their release schedule can keep up with their writing schedule, and unless single b-sides can get it all to us, I don't think I'll get my other 90 minutes of music, dude. Gotta run, KAI ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 08:13:08 +1000 From: email_address_removed.au To: email_address_removed Subject: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: I beg your pardon? Message-ID: >I'm sick of assholes liek you that think you're so fucking godlike >that everybody who doesn't know every fucking thing about Dream >Theater is a moron. It's you people sitting up on your fucking high >horse that make me want to leave this thing as the heap of shit that >it is for the most part, but every now and then somebody posts a post worth reading that >isn't bashing somebody or something, that makes it worth it. I've never seen such a post >from you. As I am sick of idiots like yourself cluttering up the jam with stupid questions and comments, yeah do us all a favour leaving the list would be a huge relief to everyone. I never claim to be god like or know anymore about DT than 'the average jammer'.What I do have is brain and use some common sense when posting to this list, you appear to have neither. I look before I leap and make a fool of myself in front of other DT fans. >Excuse me if it didn't dawn on me at the time. Since people were >taling about demos, I thought i may have been something never on an >album, and I just didn't happen to think of that song. Excuse me for fucking living. Nope, no excuse you will go straight to hell for your sins :) BTW either learn to spell or use a spell checker. >Gee, I don't see you rippingon him for posting the fact thatis >was different from another show, so why rip on me for saying it was different form the >show I saw? Mayeb you just like ripping on peopel because you have no fucking life and >nothing better to do than read your name on Jam. Nah I've been saving this one up for you for a while, you deserve it :) Wrong again I do have a life, the jam mostly brightens up my day, believe me I don't take any of this seriously. If someone deserves a rip from me they'll get it, if the glove fits wear it. >I hope Portnoy gets a copyof this one, so he can see what a fucking >loser you are. Yeah maybe I'll ask him when I see him next year, I am sure he reads you posts ROTFLHAS at someone who doesn't even know the anachronism's of DT songs. Sticks and stones Andrew graham ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:11:50 -0800 From: email_address_removed (Dr. Mosh) To: email_address_removed Subject: drummers Message-ID: If you're into kick ass drummers. The new John McLaughlin CD has Dennis Chambers on it, and he just absolutely tears it up... -The Doc -- #$%*#$*@ E-MAIL: email_address_removed #$%#$#$% _+_+_+_+ Unix, Internet, Intranet Engineering _+_+_+_+ [][][][] Dr. Mosh's Progressive Feast [][][][] #$@#$#@# http://progmetal.gmsnet.com @#$@##@$ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 08:40:52 +1000 From: email_address_removed.au To: email_address_removed Subject: UNCLASSIFIED:-My Apologies Message-ID: to the rest of the list for posting my last message to the list, further replies to Mr.Fors will be sent privately. graham ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:38:43 -0500 From: "Michael J. Emerson" To: "'Ytse Jam'" Subject: HY... Message-ID: <01BCF377.44DA5B70@EMERSON> just placed my pre-order for the 'Hollow Years' CD single... it comes out in Europe on 12/1...i'm expecting to have it in my greedy = little hands by 12/10 or so (given ship time from Europe and ship time = from the 'store'...) m. p.s.: is anything going on for pre- / post-show get-togethers for: = Tradewinds (NJ), Irving Plaza (NY), and/or Capitol Ballroom (DC)? -- m. ____________________________________________________________ Truism: Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk? Truism: Black holes are where God divided by zero. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 22:46:38 +0100 From: Seroussi To: email_address_removed Subject: Don't start flame wars, you'll scare mike! Message-ID: <3470BB3E.93323D3D@algonet.se> > From: "Andrew Fors" > Subject: I beg your pardon? > > I hope Portnoy gets a copy of this one, so he can see what a fucking > loser you are. Do you think flaming him back made you look any better? As a certain list moderator once told me 'keep this kind of flame wars off the jam' (you really ought to add it to the subscribing message...) Besides, the discussion on this list is not meant to satisfy MP's needs (at least that's not what I'm aiming to...) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:47:19 -0500 (EST) From: Phil Carter To: Under a Glass Ytse Subject: Front row, Symphony X, Angra Message-ID: Greetings ye 'jamanoids... Dr. Mosh remarked: > I used to be a front row kinda person, but really, the front row kinda sucks. > The sounds isn't as developed at all, you can't hear the mix right. > Plus, when you're recording, it's the worse place to be... ;) I have to disagree with ya, Doc. I have unfortunately only managed front row seats once in my concertgoing lifetime, but that concert (front row center for Extreme in 1993) is *still* burned into my memory as one of the best shows I've ever been to. You have to understand that when I'm at a show, I get into the music like few other people I know. I'm on my feet through the whole show, singing the lyrics, fists in the air, playing air instruments everywhere, screaming at the top of my lungs in between songs, and generally getting swept up by the music. Most of the shows I'm at, I find myself wishing that the band could see me -- so they could see how much I was enjoying myself! Most of the time the band doesn't know me from the next guy -- I'm just this little dot someplace back in row 23 or whatever. But for that show, I was right on the front row, heart in throat, moving about as much as the bandmembers themselves -- and getting noticed for a change! Pat, Nuno, and Gary spent a lot of time pointing at me and grinning ear to ear -- "hey, look at this guy, he's really getting into it! Cool!" High-fives from the band, a pick that Nuno *handed* to me, and Gary saying to the crowd "Wow, y'all are really a great crowd tonight! 'Specially you people here in the front row (pointing to me and the girl with me -- she was almost as bad as I was)!" It's nice to be able to let the band know how much you love the music, is all I'm saying. Being afforded the same opportunity for, say, Rush or DT, would be pretty damn close to a dream come true. Mike B remarked: > Actually, Russell Allen sound to me like the bastard child of Dio and > Joe Lynn Turner. I'm actually amazed that the vocals on this disc don't > get mentioned more - I think the vocal arrangements and execution is > even more spectacular than Romeo's guitar work - and let me tell ya, > that's pretty damn amazing, 'cause he's one bad MF. I think *all* the guys in Symphony X are bad MFs. Allen's got some of the most powerful pipes around, and his style is similar to Ronnie James Dio in some songs, but plenty different in others. The vocal style in "Of Sins and Shadows", for example, is uniquely Allen's, while that heard in "Pharaoh" sounds a lot more like something RJD would have done. Mike also stated: > Seriously, "Holy Land" is as good as it gets. If you want to talk about > monster players, this band is full of them. You know how they say great > athletes make the difficult look effortless? Angra takes incredible, > complex music and makes it SOUND effortless. No one should be able to do > guitar harmonies like that. It's not fair. :) I've come to with an interesting dilemma regarding "Holy Land" and "Angels Cry" -- I honestly can't decide which one I like better, because they're both so damned good! I think "Angels Cry" has more classically influenced songwriting and more keyboards (which I love), but "Holy Land" is a more mature and horizon-pushing recording, with more complex tunes and influences from ALL OVER the place. Plus, "The Shaman" is one of the coolest damn songs I've ever heard. Pick up Angra! Pick up Symphony X! Get Magellan and Lemur Voice! *pant pant pant* Okay, I'm better now... Cheers, Phil ===================================================================== Phil Carter -- email_address_removed (work), email_address_removed (personal) Tech Support, NorthEast Georgia Internet Access, 546-5787 "Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life." -- Berthold Auerbach Currently playing: Jimmy Buffett -- "Fruitcakes" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 22:57:23 -0800 From: Arash Ashouriha To: email_address_removed Subject: Where Are You Now ? Message-ID: >Dream Theater Hollow Years CDS GER PRE-order to insure discount . >Plus You And Me(Demo)/ The Way It Used To Be(prev. unreleased) $12.00 What about "Where Are You Now" ??? I was sure this would be the B-side :-((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( Where Are You Now is one of the best DT songs, which has been wrote for FII. Why DT didn't want to release it ??? So many people in this list LOVE Where Are You Now and it would be great if DT would release this great song. Please do it. Btw, What is up with the video for HY ? Is it ready now ? Arash -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | PROG OR DIE - The Progressive Music Page | | | | DREAM THEATER - FATES WARNING - ROYAL HUNT - SHADOW GALLERY | | | | http://lionel.kr.fh-niederrhein.de/~ashouria/index.htm | | OR | | http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Venue/1748/ | | | | by Arash Ashouriha | | | | email_address_removed.de | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 22:58:25 -0800 From: Arash Ashouriha To: email_address_removed, email_address_removed Subject: thanks for information ! Message-ID: Hi Thanks to all of you, who have given me so much information about YES and MARILLION. You guys are really great. Thanks again Arash -------------------------------------------------------------------------- | PROG OR DIE - The Progressive Music Page | | | | DREAM THEATER - FATES WARNING - ROYAL HUNT - SHADOW GALLERY | | | | http://lionel.kr.fh-niederrhein.de/~ashouria/index.htm | | OR | | http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Venue/1748/ | | | | by Arash Ashouriha | | | | email_address_removed.de | -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:14:04 +0000 From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: drummers Message-ID: > If you're into kick ass drummers. The new John McLaughlin CD has Dennis > Chambers on it, and he just absolutely tears it up... > > -The Doc You want a better one, pick up Que Alergia, also by McLaughlin. This one has Trilok Gurtu on the "drums". I'm not a drummer, but I know there are some here. Does anyone with knowledge of the way this freak plays want to try to explain it in words? From what I understand it's a very unorthodox technique.... but the sound is HUGE!!!! And to those who read my Symphony X post, please keep in mind that while I do understand and use grammar, sometimes my fingers don't while they're translating the impulses my brian sends them. That's why you see sentences from me that say things like "This is are a killer band"... it's because I'm a caffeine-addicted, up-all-night, post-all-day kind of freak. :) And yes, it's a damn tough decision on who's the better band... Symphony X or Angra... :) Chris Ptacek email_address_removed http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:15:48 +0000 From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: I beg your pardon? Message-ID: *Gulp* That was a bunch of shit. I just had to say that. BTW, has anyone done the "Trail of Beers" parody yet? Maybe I'll write that one... Chris Ptacek email_address_removed http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:32:50 +0000 From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Metropolis - Part 1 and 2 Message-ID: > just my opinion, and I was/am simply stirring up some ideas with you. I > don't NEED to be right, just need some good conversation. Well then, I guess we're after the same goal. But dammit I'm posting too much today! Ack Mode will do that to ya! > I just don't like the idea. I see absolutely no need to re-record a song > that I feel is perfect on I&W. I've already heard Derek play it live, and > it wasn't a drastic enough change/improvement/progression to warrant a > re-recording of it, IMO. Some of us do feel that it could be improved. That's not to say we don't love the tune, but I'd prefer a more real drum sound, and more ripping analog synths myself. Plus, I would love to have it on one disc, back to back, so the two could run right from Part 1 to Part 2. Let me say this now, though: I don't think that will ever happen, so I doubt you have anything to worry about. > not sure which method would stimulate more sales, but other than from a > possible sales standpoint, I see no reason to include it. I hope I just clarified that for you... > True, but ACOS is also an EP, and it's the length of most artists' full > length LPs. But regardless of whether the Met 2 CD is 45 min or 78 min, > I'd rather have 2 of the FII leftovers on it, than Metropolis part 1 again. > JMO. We're talking about Dream Theater though, not other bands. An album the length of ACoS will most likely always be considered an EP to them. They themselves seem to agree with you and me, that the albums should use up every pissible second of cd time. > Wrong. I read all of your post. You're assuming I didn't read the parts > that I didn't address. No, my assumptions were based on comments you made about my post, which directly conflicted with what I said. > I disagree that all of the music will necessarily > be released this time. Granted, up until now, every song has pretty much > been available to us, even if only on a single. I don't believe that will > be true now. There's simply too much material, and at the pace they are > writing, I think some will get left in the cold. Mike clearly stated about > one song "That is the 'Don't Look Past Me' of the bunch," indicating that > it probably would not be recorded or released. What I'm saying is that I'd > rather have that song on the Met 2 CD, than Met 1 again. If the band doesn't like a song, the song won't make it, whether we want it or not. Putting a song (I.E. Met pt. 1) on a disc won't change that. > I doubt it. I'm convinced that some material is going to get the shaft > this time. I hope I'm wrong. If you have another opportunity to see DT on tour, you can ask the band. But I think that's sort of silly. The songs are their bread and butter. That's how they make their money. Why would they throw away songs that they like? From a musician's standpoint, that's the last thing I would do. > The fact that DT writes material quickly > does not mean that we'll get it as quickly (take FII for example). It just > means that while the record company is dragging their feet on the next > release, they'll be writing more and more material. To this, I can only respond with watch and see. I'm giving Elektra more credit than that. The band is making money... the fans are sturring up, and the album is selling at least as well as the others. This one's seeming to get more radio play than Awake. Record companies are in it for the money. These are the trends that they watch. When DT is done touring, and says "We want a month off and then we want to go back into the studio" or whatever, they're going to get it this time. I believe that DT is destined for commercial success. When the trend is right, they'll be the next Queensryche or even the next Rush. That's my prediction. I think their bargaining powers, and the voices of their loud and annoying internet fans are growing... and you can't stop what's on its way. But I guess that just shows some optimism that was spilled into my half empty bowl of pessimist flakes. Chris Ptacek email_address_removed http://www.prognosis.com/madsman Go Home and Practice! ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3248 **************************