YTSEJAM Digest 3158 Today's Topics: 1) ok, i take it back by "Ryan P. Skadberg" 2) Yestion by Lobsterback 3) YtseContact; DT in Minneapolis by "Brian Hayden" 4) My brain is all over your guitar! by "Brian Hayden" 5) Acid Bath? by "Brian Hayden" 6) Stuff #3 (maybe 4, i lost count) by "Ryan P. Skadberg" 7) Kansas yet again by Richard Banister 8) DT in Philly by Quazel Schmirt 9) DT side projects by "Matt Pastor" 10) integrity... by email_address_removed (Ernesto Schnack) 11) Anybody in the Philippines? by Robert Jurado 12) All stupid people should be shot with a knife by Richard Banister 13) Other randomness .... by "Ryan P. Skadberg" 14) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3101 by Michael Torres 15) Kicking the dead horse known as accessibility.... by "Neal Brown" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:38:13 -0500 From: "Ryan P. Skadberg" To: email_address_removed Subject: ok, i take it back Message-ID: Hi :) I take back all the good stuff I said about Phil Carter, he said John Tesh was good ;) (just kidding Phil!!) Skadz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 22:35:24 -0500 From: Lobsterback To: email_address_removed Subject: Yestion Message-ID: Question for you big Yes-buffs out there -- I heard a 'rumor' at the Fairfax, VA concert that the new keyboardist, Igor "Ivan" Khoroshev, is only 17 years old! Can anybody verfify this? I was far enough away to not be able to tell. Also, where'd they find him? He's damn good, especially for somebody younger than me... Yah, Yes asked me to tour with them first, but I told 'em I had too much schoolwork to deal with. Far more work than last year, when I sat in for a flu-wracked Eddie Van Halen a few times. Brian Henderson email_address_removed "I'll be ready whenever you push that rewind button." -- Mr. T ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 97 21:51:58 -0600 From: "Brian Hayden" To: email_address_removed Subject: YtseContact; DT in Minneapolis Message-ID: Well everyone, the YtseContact list will once again be freshly updated by about 1 am tonight, so check it out, and sign-in if you haven't yet. On another note, anyone interested in getting together at the Minneapolis show, if you haven't already heard from me (you haven't added your name to the list yet), drop me a line at email_address_removed . We have some sort of tentative plans worked out. -Brian ******************************************************************************** "I may have wasted all those years, but they're not worth their time in tears." -John Myung of Dream Theater ******************************************************************************** Maintainer of Dream Theater North American Tour pre-show gatherings site: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/3771/dt.html ******************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 97 21:53:25 -0600 From: "Brian Hayden" To: email_address_removed Subject: My brain is all over your guitar! Message-ID: > I know some very intelligent people who aren't really into music at all, > and others who are really into it. I have thought about whether people > who are CS majors are more likely to like DT than someone who's an English > major I chose this as a lead in to my thoughts on the subect, because I've been both (that's right, comp sci and english...I quit english). I think that "intelligence" has a little to do with your musical taste, but not much. I'll explain. I believe there are basically two kinds of music listeners: 1: People who regard music as something to be in the background. These people are much more likely to listen to simple music, simply because they're not that interested in it - they just don't care about it that much. They could be geniuses, or they could be retards. Most of the population, including almost all people who listen exclusively to Top 40, fits into this group. 2: People who are focused on music. Now, there is basically one reason why people are focused on the music - emotion. Thus, we can divide this group into two sub-groups; those who are more interested in the raw emotion, and those who are more interested in the most eloquent expression of that emotion. It is within these subgroups that intelligence comes into play. In the former group, the raw emotion people, you have all sorts of tastes, but they tend to be simple. With rare exceptions, your average person will be hit harder by LL Cool J's "Mama Said Knock You Out" or Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit" than by "Learning to Live." Why? Because they are visceral, with the heart pinned on the sleeve, so to speak. It is simply an instictive reaction to feel emotion when you hear emotion (as any guy who's ever been on a date and ended up watching "Bridges of Madison County in a theater full of crying women can tell you). Once again, these people can be intelligent or not. In the latter group is where the distinctions in intelligence come into play. To reach these people, there is onw ground rule: Your message, whether it is in the lyrics, or in the feel of the music, must be expressed subtly. At this point, many of you are saying to yourself, "Subtle? What's so subtle about, say, the middle of Met Part 1?" Here is what I mean by subtle: the emotion must be expressed in a less obvious fashion, whether by building it slowly throughout the song, hiding it in cryptic lyrics, etc. Dream Theater often uses the first technique: rather than having a song hit you all at once, it keeps evolving throughout, exploring all the nuances of it's feeling. Maybe a better way, or a more understandable way, to say this is to say that an emotion is explored more fully. Of course, what I've just written, and what you probably stopped reading a while ago ;-), is a patented stereotypical generalization. There's a lot of grey area; I doubt you could find many people within the second major group which I mentioned who fit completely into either of the subgroups. I'm almost evenly divided, myself. I mostly got into DT from "Pull Me Under" - one of their few come-out-and-nail-you-songs, but I also was into ACOS early on. It amazed me how they could go for twenty minutes without being repetitive, and even more, how the music expressed the character's emotions so well - exploring all sides of the issue, rather than a four minute song with a chorus of "Carpe Diem" repeated over and over, which is how most bands would have approached the idea. Of course, most bands wouldn't have the idea in the first place. "Smells Like Teen Spirit" is a bumper sticker, a summary. "Trial of Tears" is an elucidation. Most people want to be hit with one-liners. I think the whole issue has more to do with attention span than brainpower. BTW, I used to resent the idea that people who listen to simpler music, say Black Sabbath, are stupid. However, it doesn't bother me anymore - I simply take these people for the misguided individuals that they are, and move on. As for the actual reason behind all this...beats the hell out of me. Something with the makeup of the individual brain, I guess. Of course, as Lars mentioned, much of it also has to do with how you were raised, what kind of music you heard from your parents. I'll explore that more fully if anyone cares. And the most basic fact which defines your taste: you can't like what you've never heard. Responses welcome, and I disclaim any responsibility for those who dropped dead of boredom while reading this. -Brian ******************************************************************************** "I may have wasted all those years, but they're not worth their time in tears." -John Myung of Dream Theater ******************************************************************************** Maintainer of Dream Theater North American Tour pre-show gatherings site: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/3771/dt.html ******************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 97 21:53:59 -0600 From: "Brian Hayden" To: email_address_removed Cc: Trevor R Morris Subject: Acid Bath? Message-ID: Does anyone know anything about a band called Acid Bath? The little bit I've heard sounds kind of like the newer Type O Negative, with the wicked keyboards. A guy down the hall was blasting it this afternoon...I actually thought it was TON, until the vocals kicked in. Pretty cool stuff. Any recommendations? Warnings? -Brian ******************************************************************************** "I may have wasted all those years, but they're not worth their time in tears." -John Myung of Dream Theater ******************************************************************************** Maintainer of Dream Theater North American Tour pre-show gatherings site: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/3771/dt.html ******************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 00:06:50 -0500 From: "Ryan P. Skadberg" To: email_address_removed Subject: Stuff #3 (maybe 4, i lost count) Message-ID: Hi :) Dan wrote: > By the way...why doesn;t Dream Theater just play Philly????? I mean > fuck....Fates Warning played here...why can't DT.....someone please > answer me..like that Skadz fellow...he seems to know everything!!! > Hee hee OK, let me try and clear this up for everyone. As Mike has said (and I know it was said to people on the jam), the current tour is a "scratching the surface" tour. They are just playing a small amount of dates. They will be playing EVERYWHERE in 98. OK? Is this settled? I have gotten some other questions about this too, so I just wanna make this clear. (Dan, not trying to jump down your back at all) Dr Teeth wrote: > P.S. On a local Hard-core metal show (93-X's Extreme Metal Shop), they > played a band by the name of Sugar Ray and it sounded NOTHING like the > band that's currently on MTV singing "Fly". There is a chance though > that it's the same band and is just really an eclectic sounding > group... Who noze? Same band :) The song they play on the radio is the ONLY one of its type on the whole CD. The rest of the CD is basically hardcore stuff :) Skadz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:42:02 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Banister To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Kansas yet again Message-ID: > I gotta disagree with this assessment of Kansas, keeping in mind that I was > about 4 when they were at their height. Sure, they broke with Leftoverture > which had the very radio-friendly "Carry On Wayward Son", and continued > their sales streak with POKR, but I don't think they changed their writing > on that album just to guarantee sales. While "Dust in the Wind," and > "Point of Know Return" have _sales_ written all over them, tunes like > "Closet Chronicles" and "Paradox" are pure Kansas. Well, they're a progressive rock band. . they just progressed to their next level. We may not like that level very much, but that's where they went. Actually, the story of Dust in the Wind goes something like: Kerry was in his hotel room one night after a show, and just started playing this finger picked progression (the opening and closing of DitW), because he could never finger pick before. Then later, when they were recording, and needed more space, he played it, and they were like 'oooo. . .' and so they threw it on (story may not be completely accurate, I always get it confused with the story of ELPs "lucky man"). IMO it doesn't sound anything at all like anything else on that album.. and I like all the other songs more (except Sparks of the tempest. . . what the fuck is that?. . .), but that's okay. Oh yeah. . . and it was the second song I ever learned how to play on Guitar. That's why it's so famous now. . :) > past the popiness, "People of the Southwind" is a killer song also. heh heh. . . I heard that song, and it just cracked me up. That's one of the reasons I love Kansas. . . > that drastically, just because they hit stardom. Kerry's the man. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ And yet he's named after a woman. Isn't it ironic? figuratively, Rich ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:47:53 -0500 (EST) From: Quazel Schmirt To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: DT in Philly Message-ID: I just wanted to second Dan's sentiment about DT playing in Philly. It is a thriving metropolis, so to speak. It probably has more draw potential that Old Bridge or Sea Bright (can you tell I am actually from Old Bridge?) ever will. Philly is actually on the map! Anyway, just thought I would add my 2 pennies since it has been a while. Hope to make it to Sea Bright and see everyone. Couldn't they have waited one more week so it was during my break???? Jill ----------- Quazel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:54:20 -0500 From: "Matt Pastor" To: Subject: DT side projects Message-ID: A friend of mine ordered a Royal Hunt CD via snail mail and when he received it he also got a lisiting of upcoming releases from Magna Carta Records. Among these releases was what was referred to as the Portnoy, Petrucci, Levin, & Rudess Project. Does anyone have any idea what this is about? I hadn't seen it mentioned on the jam recently so either it's old news or not many people are aware of it. This release sheet also mentions that Petrucci, Derek, and Billy Sheehan are special guestss on Magellan's album that will be released in early '98. Can anyone shed any light on these mysterious albums? I've been back on The Jam for 3 weeks after 1 1/2 years of being absent, so I may have missed something. Somebody please fill me in. P.S. Is Bafu Vai no longer with us? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:53:57 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Ernesto Schnack) To: Subject: integrity... Message-ID: > It used to be believed that Hydrogen was the most abundant element in the > universe. However, it is now clear that stupidity is much more abundant. > Well if your gonna be quoting somebody, at least give credit... especially when it's a Zappa quote:P >>Soooooooo, if you dont give a shit about artistic integrity, your stupid? > ^^^^ >>How important is artistic integrity anyways? Sometimes I think its just >>their to fill up the ol' ego, and give more validity to art than it really > ^^^^^ > >This must be the exception that proves the rule. > >KAI Thank you for actually adding something to the conversation rather than just pointing out spelling errors anyone could make... >> Soooooooo, if you dont give a shit about artistic integrity, your >stupid? >> How important is artistic integrity anyways? > >Well, I would have to say, _very_ important. I'm sick and fucking tired >of seeing bands with absolutely no talent routinely make gold and platinum >selling albums, and bands like DT dabble in obscurity. talent or the lack of it doesn't have anything to do with artistic integrity. I'm talking about 'doing art for yourself' and not letting outside elements (like money) affect it. And really, how many musicians out there dont conform in one way or another? I'll admit I've changed my approach to songwriting just because of audience response, and im sure im not the only one. Ærnesto ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 13:06:13 +0800 (PST) From: Robert Jurado To: email_address_removed Subject: Anybody in the Philippines? Message-ID: Hey... Any jammers out there in the Philippines? I'm actually from the States, but I came over here to go to school for a while. I've been off the jam for about a year, because I've been moving around so much. Now, I'm back. I am so out of the loop. I hadn't even heard about FII until I saw an ad in a guitar mag, which cost me close to US$7.00. Damn... To all you guys in the States, you're making really jealous and homesick, because of all these DT shows you're going to. F*&k you all for that! :) -Rob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 00:02:51 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Banister To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: All stupid people should be shot with a knife Message-ID: > From: "TheCowGod" > Subject: The geriatric exoneration of trephined neanderthals from our society > What if you get a 1490 on your SATs and like punk? Are you stupid? Haha, > got you there, huh? ahh, but you didn't! For you realize, I was able to analyze this with my patented "stupidityness-meter(tm)," and have found that your brother is THE STUPIDEST PERSON ON EARTH. To clarify, I shall explain the testing process. His score on the SAT is 1490, which I then multiply by his IQ (I am assuming this to be 0, since none was specified). Then, by assigning values to the various styles of music he listens to, (i.e. progressive rock = 1000, classical = 900, pop = 3, punk = 2, R&B = 1.5, rap = -1. We will discuss Yanni in a moment), I use the doorknob principle we all know and love(look it up) to interpret the result as the sum of a square and an integer. If he likes Yanni, his address is then recorded, and he is tracked down, dragged into the street, and shot like a rabid dog. Then, using the SAT*IQ scores previously attained, complete the square, to find his base intelligenceness, which in this case, is zero. This result is then thrown out, and if he likes everything that I like, he is intelligent. If he doesn't, he is THE STUPIDEST PERSON ON EARTH. You see? > intelligence and all and I just HAD to post something light-hearted. It's > my religion, sorry. And also, don't be afraid if you don't understand my religion is to follow in kind, except this time be serious, and completely non-sensical. . . :& > Oh yeah, moo. moof. figuratively, with a side of pork and gristle, Rich ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 01:15:43 -0500 From: "Ryan P. Skadberg" To: email_address_removed Subject: Other randomness .... Message-ID: Hi :) Four posts in a row from me, how special :) Toad's Place Stuff: First, the show was great, as would be expected. There were some small screwups here and there, but hey, it was the first night of the tour. And they played our "theme song", so it can't get much better than that :) It was very cool getting to meet some jammers after the show :) I always like to meet more people from the list :) So, hi everyone!! ;) Mike told me to tell everyone hello. He said they are still working on the setlist and stuff will probably change over the course of the tour. Other than that not much new news. Ytsejam Stuff: We are back up to about 800 jammers. I apologize for the problems again. I am working on some more stuff to make sure this doesn't happen again. I also have a little help from my friends (aka that kbibb dude), which is helping. If you need old jams, try: ftp://ftp.dreamt.org/pub/ytsejam/ I am working on a mail archive (and working on getting the real archive fixed) Ytsejammers, Spending Money Into Infinity, Etc OK, at shows, if you see some kid with long hair and a ytsejam sweatshirt on, come say hello to me. I swear I won't bite (well .. ferget it, we won't go there ;) I always love meeting jammers, so come up and say hello :) Also, after shows, kinda head towards the stage and hang out for a bit, I always do and its a great opporunity to meet ytsejammers. As for the rest of the mini-tour, I SHOULD be at the Jersey, NYC, and Poughkepsie (however the hell you spell that) shows. So, if you see me, come say hi :) Well, enough from me Skadz +-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-+ | Ryan Skadberg | "feed my head, with some real thoughts, | | Ytsejam Moderator | and let me think instead of being taught, | | email_address_removed | i'll say things you won't believe, | | http://www.dreamt.org/ | just stand back, just let me breathe......" | | | "Just Let Me Breathe" -Dream Theater | +-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-=-+*+-+ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:24:57 -0600 (CST) From: Michael Torres To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3101 Message-ID: maybe something is wrong with my email but is there a reason why i haven't recieved a ytsejam in like a week...i was getting used to going through about 4 jams a day ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 21:24:45 PST From: "Neal Brown" To: email_address_removed Subject: Kicking the dead horse known as accessibility.... Message-ID: >> Soooooooo, if you dont give a shit about artistic integrity, your >>stupid? How important is artistic integrity anyways? >Well, I would have to say, _very_ important. I'm sick and fucking >tired of seeing bands with absolutely no talent routinely make gold >and platinum selling albums, and bands like DT dabble in obscurity. >My high school art teachers favorite expression was "you have to know >the rules before you can break them." For example, Picasso (I'll use >him even though I don't like his work). If you see his work, you may >think "what the fuck? Two eyes on one side of a head?" But the >reality is that that guy had incredible skill in realist art as well >(witness his pencil sketches). The guy was an incredible artist >because he knew how to bend reality to his vision. Exactly. Let me toss this out there: whether or not something/somone is as "good" or as "smart" or whatever as something/someone else is a vague question. It depends on how you look at it. If you say, "DT rocks because they use weird time sigs, therefore they're better than Green Day" you're being a little silly. If you say "DT is better than Green Day because Green Day is barely distinguishable from most other flash-in-the-pan grunge groups whereas DT has made a name for itself by being original," that's different, and since I have a "SNOOBY, ELITIST ATTITUDE" (jeez....gotta learn to use the spell checker), that's a valid statement to me. Of course, you can also say that since nobody's opinion is necessarily better than anyone else's, Green Day and OFB are equals. (Pardon me while I retch.) Let's put it like this. Find an "average dickhead" who has never been exposed to, say, King Crimson. Play something psychotic...something like "Larks Tongues" part one. If he's into rap, he'll be looking for the thump-thump but won't get it. He gets IMHO some truly awesome beats, but nothing steady. If he's into country, he'll be wondering where the damn steel guitar is the whole time, or he'll be waiting for the vocals to hum along with. (That's not a very catchy tune. Heh heh.) You see what I mean? Let me throw out one more thing...I love being flamed, can't you tell? Maybe I should seek therapy....anyway...Those of whose Page Down keys are getting worn out from skipping past analyses of DT: so what? If your keyboard's that shitty, get a new one already. Sheesh. Personally, I would LOVE to see some more analysis of music on this list. If you think that makes me anal or nerdy or something, FUCK OFF! I don't care. It's far more relevant than 90% of the dogshit that gets mailed in here. When I listen to music, I can listen to it just for its own sake, or I can listen to it for artistic value. And when I hear a truly weird time sig, I'm curious and inquistice enough to want to know what the hell it is. If I can't figure it out, I'm going to ask....which is what some people did a few weeks ago with New Millenium, and the JLMB/WFS riff. Also: no, if Albert Einstein didn't like DT I wouldn't think he's stupid. If you want to be very particular, I would think if he (or any other discriminating person) actually listened to DT and gave it a chance, and still didn't like it, I think they'd be missing out. If some "average dickhead" refuses to even listen to a song with more than three chords in it, I call him a fucking musical coward, since he can't even stick his head out of his shell long enough to be exposed to something that may make him think. Is that elitist? You damn right. Is there anything wrong with that? No. Would you criticize Alan Greenspan for knowing too much about the economy?? Jeezus. Wow, this is long....man... >I personally think Neal deserves congratulations for his intelligent >and well-restrained response to that drivel. Neal made some good >points, agree with them or not, and got screamed at, and further >justified his points with proper restraint and more intelligence. To >whoever cursed him, you're not even worth the time it would take to >go back and check your name. Shame on you. *sigh* It's not easy being perfect....BWAHAHAHAHAHA!! (Just kidding, for those of you who don't understand how to unsubsrcibe....) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3158 **************************