YTSEJAM Digest 3042 Today's Topics: 1) Hair's to you, Merlo by "Larry" 2) RE: Re: Dazed and Confused by "Edwin Voras" 3) NDTC Unforgiven Pt 2 by Pat Daugherty 4) Re: FII quotes by "ÞrØgßø¥" 5) The location of New Millennium by The Phoenix 6) This is what I *really* meant about the analylisation thang. by Andreas =?iso-8859-1?Q?Wallstr=F6m?= 7) Christopher Merlo by email_address_removed (Stephen LaMonica) 8) FII singles by Christian P Kremo 9) ...And now for something completely different.... by Shai Yallin 10) Re: APSoG: One song or more?; Grammar et al. by Rick Audet 11) Re: Quick Questions by Shai Yallin 12) Time to get out the fire extinguisher by "Brown, Neal Patrick" 13) The final tape swap post by "The Notorious B.I.G. S.W.I.F.T.Y." 14) Re: Understanding of Complex Music by Jeremy Ulrey 15) fantasy hockey by Pat Daugherty 16) Jazz influence on FII by Jeremy Kube 17) what the hell i'm supose to write here? by email_address_removed.il ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 13:56:57 -0400 From: "Larry" To: Subject: Hair's to you, Merlo Message-ID: D-Man wrote: > Um, to be totally accurate, "hair's" is also a contraction of the words "hair is." So, actually, "hair's" would be more correct here than "hairs," since in the sentence "you ask me why my hairs gray," gray would be the verb. It's obvious, though, that the intended verb is "is," because that other form is aqkward as hell - gramatically correct, yes, but no one talks like that. Hence "why my hair's gray." > > (I'm taking a course this semester on natural language parsing. Don't fuck with me about grammar. :) Uh, OK, but can we fuck with you about your spelling, then? Aqkward??? Gramatically??? :^) I know - typos, not really mistakes . . . BTW, Chris, a friend of mine just saw your sig and swears he recognizes it from another list - the Z-car list? A porno list, prehaps? Just so you know, I get a little miffed when I see the same questions being asked over and over, too. And shit like "I used to be on this list, and now I'm back, so is the new album out yet?" is the worst. Can't you at least READ ONE 'JAM before you post to it? Larry p.s. I know, nobody asked, but I LOVE FII !!! p.p.s. So is it really "sullied", like somebody wrote, or is it "solid"? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 08:58 -0700 (MST) From: "Edwin Voras" To: Ytsejam Subject: RE: Re: Dazed and Confused Message-ID: <19970929161334.AAA7918@localHost> Eckie wrote: > I wish I had more of these I&W shirts, 'cuz this one's >starting to smell bad! Hey Eckie, Try washing it once in a while. Man, "College kids" Ytse on anyways, eD ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:17:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Daugherty To: Dream Theater Mailing List Subject: NDTC Unforgiven Pt 2 Message-ID: In one of my hard rock/HM newsletters it mentions the new Metallica cd will have a song called "The Unforgiven Pt 2". Anyone know more about this? My Ytsejam fantasy football team is horrible. After a great first week (sorry Mike), it has been horrible... You would think that if a trio of Raymont Harris, Terry Allen, and Eddie George could amass 271 rushing yards that at least one of them would get into the end zone... |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | Pat Daugherty email_address_removed | |===================================================================| | New Dream Theater-September 23, 1997 *** Washington Redskins 3-1 | | Congrats to the American League East Champion Baltimore Orioles!! | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:11:25 -0400 From: "ÞrØgßø¥" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: FII quotes Message-ID: Steve Zebrowski wrote: > > In the stream of consciousness > > There is a river crying > > Living comes much easier > > Once we admit , We're dying. > > Dream Theater: Lines in the Sand > > http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro > > mailto:email_address_removed mailto:email_address_removed > > Universal Internet Number (ICQ) 1254229 > > This quote almost inspired me to create a new .sig file for myself, but I > see someone has already beat me to it. This is the best part of the > album, IMO. > > Steve Z Thanx man!! i was planning on changin it .. to something off of JLMB...but now ive decided against to!! :) thanx man.. it really is the best part.. IMO of course -- In the stream of consciousness There is a river crying Living comes much easier Once we admit , We're dying. Dream Theater: Lines in the Sand http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro mailto:email_address_removed mailto:email_address_removed Universal Internet Number (ICQ) 1254229 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 13:26:12 -0500 (CDT) From: The Phoenix To: email_address_removed Subject: The location of New Millennium Message-ID: A single star behind me A red sky burns ahead A lonely light below me Awake among the dead Anyone else get the feeling that he's in an airplane? Also, if you haven't gotten the new Metal Edge, do so now. It has a 5 page interview with the band. MP says how it is him, DS, and JP doing the voice box in BMS. He whispers and the other two speak at normal volume or something like that. -~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_- | Robert Taylor The world may seem flown away | | email_address_removed Almost as if it cannot be saved | | The Phoenix Will we be able to rise | | From these ashes we've sown | -~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_-~-_- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Jan 1997 10:06:54 +0100 From: Andreas =?iso-8859-1?Q?Wallstr=F6m?= To: email_address_removed Subject: This is what I *really* meant about the analylisation thang. Message-ID: (I wrote) >>Please don't analyze the music - enjoy it! (Jason wrote) >huh? I'm sorry, but for me (as a musician), when I analyze the music, I >get a whole helluva lot more out of it than if I just play it in the >background... some of the best posts IMO have been the people outlining the >music by time and pointing out cool nuances found in certain songs (BTW >whoever posted that frame by frame analysis of New Millenium a while >back... I listened to some of the things you were referencing, and It >helped me appreciate the song ALL THE MORE!!!) OK, let me rephrase and tell you what I really meant (I didn't get that through last time, sorry). I think it's OK to analyze in that sense that you try to understand what they want to say with the lyrics and what they do in the songs on their instruments *plus* recognizing parts where they've been influenced by a certain artist. I could easily say that; * LaBrie's vocals in the beginning of NM sounds like Alice In Chains influence. * Derek's keyboard work in BMS is *very* Jon Lordish. * JLMB has the aggression of Prodigy's "Firestarter". * The part after the first chorus in AL, where Mike comes in with a fill, is very Beatles (so is the coming verse). What I *really* mean with all this Jason, is that I don't think it's good to pick songs a part like some people do. Then the feeling DT is trying to give us, is lost. And a last thing on Doug's involvement: First I thought, "what the fuck is this?". Now, after listening to it a zillion times, I think it was bloody brilliant to bring someone in who has a totally different character in his voice. It broadens the song actually. FII is probably DT's best ever! I fucking love it!! Andy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:48:17 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed (Stephen LaMonica) To: email_address_removed Subject: Christopher Merlo Message-ID: I am sorry for insulting your precious FAQ file, but I am in school, and the Web has been down for about a week now. All I have is email. Thus, I wasn't able to check for the Hamlet quote in your little FAQ file. I recieved an answer from a kind soul in here who didn't have a problem answering my question. By the way, I don't believe that my question took up precious space, as I contributed a web site for Clockwork if anybody was interested. I understand that you are maintaining a FAQ file, but personally, I don't care. If I had the time to go on the web, I would, but I really don't care to look for an answer to something that can easily be answered over this. It is not worth your time or mine to argue over something as insignificant and petty as this seems to be. I will go on with my life, and you will go on w/ yours. By the way, I don't appreciate having my intelligence insulted. I am a straight A student at Saint Joseph's University, and I don't wish to be deemed a "stupid ass" because I have a question. Thank you. Let's just drop it now. I hope everyone got a chance to check out Clockwork's website. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:55:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Christian P Kremo To: ytse jam Subject: FII singles Message-ID: Has there been word yet about singles for FII? Obviously it would be an import, so it might take a while for it to get over here. I was just wondering if it had been released already, but has made it over just yet. To Jeff E.: When this single does come out, you'd better buy it right away so you can't complain to me about it being out of production anymore. (I'll sell you the "Lie" single for $60....snicker). -C# (no sig, not that pretentious) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 20:59:21 +0200 From: Shai Yallin To: email_address_removed Subject: ...And now for something completely different.... Message-ID: Hi all one again... I got "the best of ELP" today... and I have to say that's not exactly what I was expacting. I don't think it's right to define it as 'prog'. It's seems more like jazz/fusion to me. Anyhow, it's fuckin' awesome!! especially Tarkus.... Moore is dead. long live Emerson! (just kiddin' but this guy rules) Now waiting for the next Dream Theater DVD - "We can kick everyone else's ass", including the new 24-hour epic - "A change of daytime" featuring a 1-hour JP solo where you can really hear his influences; a 1.5-hour DS solo where he plays every single effect on his Trinity, a 2-hour DS/JP unison like you've never heard, a 30 min Portnoy solo, a long Myung solo on his new improved 40-string stick and lyrics by all of the band member. Also included: 3 complete live shows: 1 from the I&W tour, 1 from the Awake tour, and 1 from the FII tour; Metropolis parts II, III and IV; And finally, a song written by Derek called "Moore sucks I rule", where he plays a very fast solo using a .WAV effect of one of his farts after eating some chilli over a basic line on a 39/64 time signature. -- Shai Yallin - Kurush on #YTSEJAM "I'm American, honey. Our names don't mean shit." - Bruce Willis on Pulp Fiction "How can you keep your head and not go insane when the only light at the end of the tunnel is another train" - Mike Portnoy Visit my home page at http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Palladium/3247 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 15:16:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Audet To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: APSoG: One song or more?; Grammar et al. Message-ID: At first, that Audet character wrote: > > Noticing this discussion about Fates Warning's "A Pleasant Shade > > of Gray" (aka APSoG) I thought I'd let my *ears* decide how many > > songs there might be on this item. Yeah sure, it's an album made > > up of twelve unnamed parts, but does APSoG really sound like one > > long song? Here's what my ears came up with: Then Monsieur Le "Q" replied: > Well, why don't you think of this. Does ACOS sound like ONE song? Well, to *me* ACoS sounds like one song. > No, it sounds like 7 small songs. That's fine. I'm not saying you're wrong. :) > Does "Supper's Ready" sound like ONE song? Can't say I've ever heard it. I'll let you know when I do, though. > Does "2112" sound like ONE song? This is a tough one, for me. I haven't listened to it in a while, but I would venture to say I hear a group of related yet discrete songs. Something like that....I'd have to go back and listen to that one again. > Come on People this is progressive music > and songs going through many changes is nothing new. I'm not sure I follow this. I don't see how being "progressive" has anything to do with this. All I'm saying is I don't hear one long song. Simple as that. If you hear one long song, great. I try to let my ears decide and not the musical label, whether the songwriters choose to call it one song or not. > What is amazing about > APSOG is the feeling that runs through the whole thing. The song changes > drastically throughout but the overall feeling remains constant. > Understand now? You realize, by saying "understand now", it sounds like you're telling me what the *law* is, or some invariant behavior. Kind of like, "The signal distortion spectrum is all odd harmonics because the time-domain clipping is symmetric. Understand now ?" Is there some rule in a book somewhere I have yet to learn about regarding the unity or discreteness in music? If so, please point me to this goldmine of musical knowledge because I'd really like to "understand now". But until then, I will continue to hear APSoG as several songs. It's no big deal, and I wondered if anyone else felt this way. You obviously do not. Good for you. Understand now? ---------------------------------------- Since the topic of "forbidden discussion topics mentioned in the intro letter" came up, I was wondering if maybe a new rule should be added to the list. How about: "Do not flame anyone for imperfect grammar and spelling. Not everyone is as adept as you at the English language, and this is an international mailing list. " Just a thought. Good day, Rick Audet ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 21:50:30 +0200 From: Shai Yallin To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Quick Questions Message-ID: Christopher R. Merlo wrote: > And if I see one more stupid-ass question, or one more "unsubscribe me" > message, I'm going postal. *Everyone* that does stupid shit gets a copy of > the FAQ. > Well, I don't know about that. D-Man, you have to think one step forward. The FAQ is about 100K and it's text. Which means it can compress easily. Why won't you send the DT Doom level which is a 600K zip file? has a much wider effect. Also, if we ever wanna mailbomb anyone, this is the file to send..... Or, if you can program a bit, create a program that makes a file full of random ascii shit... like a 2 meg file of ascii... cannot be compressed even a bit and has the advantage of not knowing what hit them.... (I guess you know who to blame when you get 1200 DT FAQS....) Just thinking one step ahead, -- Shai Yallin - Kurush on #YTSEJAM "I'm American, honey. Our names don't mean shit." - Bruce Willis on Pulp Fiction "How can you keep your head and not go insane when the only light at the end of the tunnel is another train" - Mike Portnoy Visit my home page at http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Palladium/3247 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:57:46 CDT From: "Brown, Neal Patrick" To: Subject: Time to get out the fire extinguisher Message-ID: Loren's response to "the fucking Israeli guy" was way out of line...I happen to agree with you, I like FII, and I think his opinions were kinda screwy, but jeez...chill out. This is a fucking BAND we're talking about here, it's not like we're getting into this much of a lather over something that is more serious. As seriously as I take music, I know that it's not something worth getting into a fistfight over. Also--if you're going to criticize someone based on their grammar, make sure yours is spotless. Case in point: "you're" is a contraction of "you are," and isn't the possessive. (You frequently said "you're opinions," etc.) Also: ridiculous doesn't have an e in it....just minor things.... *puts on his flame resistant suit and suntan oil* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 15:00:02 -0500 From: "The Notorious B.I.G. S.W.I.F.T.Y." To: email_address_removed Subject: The final tape swap post Message-ID: Hi, everyone. The URLs containing the tape swap pairings were sent out this morning. If you answered my little questionnaire a few weeks ago but didn't get an email from me, please let me know. Sorry about the NDTC, this is the last tape swap-oriented post I'll send to this list. Mark Peters email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:58:24 -0700 From: Jeremy Ulrey To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Understanding of Complex Music Message-ID: Dave Silva wrote:

>Guess what.  Playing an instrument very well in no way gives a deeper
>understanding of music.  I don't know how many glam bands had very good
>guitarists, but their ability at writing music was obviously quite
>sub-par.

This is true only to the extent that the guitarist (substitute any instrument here) has a poor understanding of music theory.  I don't think these people are saying that because they play guitar they have a superior opinion;  they're saying that because they understand music theory they have a more informed opinion than those who know nothing of the subject.  There is a common misconception that learning music theory traps you into a binding set of rules which makes all music sound common and indifferential.  This is a crock of shit.  Yes, music is more about taste than mathematical formulas, but it is the domain of music theory to understand these tastes in terms of such concepts as melodic intervals, counterpoint, etc.  There's an old saying that in order to break the rules, you have to know what those rules are (it sounds better in the original Croatian).  I think it's well advised to take this into consideration when attempting to discredit music theory as a means of artistic merit.  It could even be argued with good reason that it is impossible to be fundamentally original without understanding the tools you are given to build with.  To approach music from a purely instinctive stance is to be forced to ape the styles of those who precede you.  The important thing to remember is that even great guitarists who have no formal knowledge of music theory work within the same boundaries as those who do.  The difference is that it takes the untrained mind much longer to come up with the same ideas.  The untrained guitarist might stumble onto the fact that power chords make good rhythm for hard rock purposes (though he most likely read it in a magazine).  He might not understand the intervalic relationship inherent in the power chord, but the trained guitarist does.  He also knows where to find other octaves of the chord on the neck, and which notes could be added to the chord for color;  something the untrained guitarist would feel lucky to stumble onto even after several hours or even days of practice.
    No, what I'm sick of hearing is how anyone who deems himself worthy to have an opinion is just as worthy of being taken seriously as someone whose knowledge completely dwarfs his own.

Jeremy Ulrey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 16:04:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Pat Daugherty To: Dream Theater Mailing List Subject: fantasy hockey Message-ID: There is now a Ytsejam Fantasy Hockey League at espn.com. To join go to http://espn.com and signup and pay for a team. After signing up join the Ytsejam Fantasy Hockey League. It is public so there is no password. The draft is slated for Oct 8. The NHL season starts Oct 1, so all stats for your starters will be rectroactive to the start date. So if you missed out on all the fun and desperation associated with the Ytsejam Fantasy Football League, you can now join the Ytsejam Fantasy Hockey League. Join up now. |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | Pat Daugherty email_address_removed | |===================================================================| | New Dream Theater-September 23, 1997 *** Washington Redskins 3-1 | | Congrats to the American League East Champion Baltimore Orioles!! | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 16:08:04 -0400 From: Jeremy Kube To: email_address_removed Subject: Jazz influence on FII Message-ID: I recently had a deep rooted conversation with my buddy Rick about the influences on new album, FII. For starters, I feel that this album has shown a lot of jazz feel to it. Specifically the keyboard parts that DS added on this album, they were more fluent and "bouncy" as opposed to KM's straight forward approach. Both were good, but I enjoy the new style more.. I think that this new jazzy approach and feel to the album has a great deal to do with the education of DT's members at Berkeley (a school that is almost totally influenced by jazz, it's known that they educate with jazz as the main interest) Also, the grooves on this album tend to be more, well, groovy. I guess that comes with time. I feel a huge Rush influence on Trial of Tears and some on New Millenium. Peruvian Skies' guitar riff in middle (the heavy part) seems a lot like a Metallica sound, maybe not the riff but the heavy sound feels like the sound Metallica acheives. Hollow Years, is a great straight forward song. I really enjoy this song.. it moves, and has a great emotional feel to it, incidently the same feel I get when I listen to Trial of Tears (i.e. "It's raining...") As for BMS and YNM, I still have yet to find an influence. YNM, seems totally different from the rest. BMS, is darker than the other songs and doesn't even seem to fit the "tone" of the album, although a great song. Hells Kitchen I consider part of BMS (considering it was yanked out of the middle of it) TAMP is jazz influenced. I can feel the jazz in it when I listen to it. Later, J ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Sep 97 23:27:18 PDT From: email_address_removed.il To: email_address_removed Subject: what the hell i'm supose to write here? Message-ID: few things: 1) about my writing: i'm from israel!! from where the hell i'm supose to know how to write english??? i just know how to talk from TV! so please pass the grammer mistakes next time,will ya? 2) if someone wants realy bad the tabs for ACOS i allready know 3 parts,and with a little will power i'll transcript the rest.... 3)best part of FII:JLMB : 3:20-4:11 and the solo of PS is good too 4)loren caler- shut the fuck up! who asked you? i'm just giving my honest opinion(i think that some of you will party on that one...) 5)my listing of the songs of the album: 1.new millennium 2.trail of tears 3.just let me breathe 4.lines in the sand 5.burning my soul 6.hell's kitchen 7.burning my soul 8.hollow years and i think you all know what i think about the 3 others songs.. ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3042 **************************