YTSEJAM Digest 3013 Today's Topics: 1) FALLING INTO ???... by "S.D.D." 2) Metropolis II EP : Delayed by YtseJim 3) Falling Into Infinity Pt.I by email_address_removed 4) Re: YTSEJAM digest 3012 by hazzy 5) Falling Into Infinity Pt.I by email_address_removed 6) A New Millenium listening guide by Chris Ptacek 7) Re: FALLING INTO ???... by Eckie 8) FII (again) by "Richard A. Rivera" 9) Pretty low by "Neil Gallop" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 23:18:17 -0400 From: "S.D.D." To: YTSEJAM Subject: FALLING INTO ???... Message-ID: I have not received the YTSEJAM digests for about a year now (as many of you know that their quality has greatly diminished), so I am unaware of the opinions of the new album by the net critics, but I just thought I, as a fellow admirer of Dream Theater's music and a musician, would contribute my little candid "review" of the new album for those who may be interested. I know many DT fans were half-expecting to be somewhat disappointed by DT's supposed new song formats (i.e. hooks, catchy choruses, shorter lengths, too melodic, dilution more accessible to radio, etc.), but after I heard "Falling Into Infinity," I saw that, for the most part, these accusations were either exaggerated or essentially non-issues for me (excepting pop man Desmond Child's "You Not Me" - which definitely would have been better with reworked lyrics/vocals; and the 80's-style "Anna Lee" - sorry James). On the whole the album is more focused, but really no more commercialized, than "Images and Words." Musically, there are some really deep grooves and great sections (reminiscent of "Caught In A Web," "Lie," etc.) scattered throughout (within such tracks as "New Millennium," "Burning My Soul," "Lines In The Sand," "Deep In Heaven," "Just Let Me Breathe"; the latter of which I wish was an instrumental instead). However, I have to admit that I was generally disappointed, especially with a three year interim between albums. Lyrically, there does not appear to be a single ray of light, hope, encouragement, positivity or anything edifying or Godly in the entire hour and twenty minutes; not even from the usually uplifting Myung. Even the generally harsh "Awake" album was more inspiring than Infinity in places! I hope you are skimming through the YTSEJAM e-mails today Mike - you especially need to lighten up. I don't think you guys know how much influence you have on so many people (particularly the highly mercurial, embittered and rebellious bulk of the "Generation X"), but it's a serious responsibility to be doing what you five are doing. The darker side of human emotions (pain, frustration, anger, loneliness, betrayal, doubt, confusion, fear, disappointment, stress, etc.) have their appropriate time and place (for example, John's sort of Fishy/Marillion-esque "Take Away My Pain" was handled better), but you've got to be careful with how you channel such feelings and attitudes into music, and, though it is not always particularly easy, such things should always be balanced out in following songs (which, sadly, is lacking in Infinity). Another prog. rock band with that same problem (which is apparently the trademark of the majority of rock music today) is Queensryche - quality music but, lyrically, too much complaining about socio-political (and personal) problems and providing no real solution(s) or hope. Though Infinity's lyrics were generally negative (at least leaving the listener hanging), I was glad to see that they were not entirely like those of previous albums in that much of the lyrical content previously was cryptic, quasi-Jungian/-Catholic, and pseudo-"deep" psychospiritual poetry and philosophy (somewhat like classic Yes; except Anderson & Co. were not as depressing). Sadly, originality is still lacking to a degree - there's the surrealistic Rush/Pink Floydian artwork (artsy nonsense in my opinion); Sebastian-esque vocals; parts sounding too much like Metallica (e.g. "Peruvian Skies" and "New Millennium" - anyone hear Metallica's semi-Eastern "Everywhere I Roam" in the latter?; remember "Pull Me Under" too?); many obvious Rush emulations (e.g. "Lines In The Sand"); and so on. I do like the new Central/South American experimentation in "Peruvian Skies" and "Hollow Years" (even if the latter is a bit too much like Sting and the vocals need a little help). Hearing the occasional subtle influences of other artists in music is completely normal and expected, but I think that the fine line to overt imitation has been crossed one too many times. I think DT would benefit greatly from a new instrumentalist(s) who has a fresh foreign style or one who plays a completely atypical instrument, such as an innovative rock violinist (perhaps Myung could do some of that here and there). And I have to admit that although I enjoy some of Derek's work on the album (e.g. "New Millennium," "Burning My Soul," "Lines In The Sand" and "Just Let Me Breathe"), I do prefer Kevin's more dynamic touches with pitchbending, vibrato and the like (though I do not miss Moore's recent strange dialogue samples and dismal/surly lyrics). Derek is certainly aggressive and focused (and I do like that too), but I personally prefer Kevin's more European (Classical) accents, as opposed to jazzy and bluesy keyboards. It is too bad one of DT's key contributors has gone off the deep end. I am glad to see, however, that DT's characteristic synchronized keyboard doubling with John has not left. And I do admire Myung's Stick additions on this album. That man seems to keep stretching to a new level of difficult instrumentation with each album! Petrucci is excellent as well (I didn't mean to exclude)! Say did anyone else catch Caveman's obvious editing flaw on "New Millennium" at approx. 5:45? I know it's a difficult task to patch together music like that, but that would have been a great section if only that glitch were absent. I just hope DT puts out some more refreshing material (even an EP) before the soon-coming new millennium (civil or messianic - whichever comes first).... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 23:32:03 -0400 From: YtseJim To: email_address_removed Subject: Metropolis II EP : Delayed Message-ID: Metropolis II release date was set at early 98... I have now been told that the record company wants to put it on hold for middle of 98. Yeah, yeah, I know. New dream theater album is released and i'm talkin about the next one :) Just thought someone might be interested.... later YtseJim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 00:41:36 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Falling Into Infinity Pt.I Message-ID: Wow!! I am having a hard time believing that it si finally here. The sinle most recurring thought while listening the third or fourth time is "THIS IS THE GROOVINGEST(is that a real word?) BAND AND ALBUM THAT I HAVE EVER HEARD!!!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 21:59:27 -0700 From: hazzy To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 3012 Message-ID: > The lack of JLB's vibratto is the single biggest problem I have with > this album. The slow songs suffer immeasurably because of it (and yes, > this is IMO). His voice is just so _plain_ without it! It's like he's > holding back all of that talent he has. WHY? I'm curious to know if > this was the producer's suggestion, or if this is just another way of > him experimenting with his voice, ala "growling" on Awake (which I > actually didn't mind). If it's the latter, I see it a dismal failure. Cool, finally someone else who see's it my way. I asked a freind if he noticed it, and he said, "Vibratto? That's pussy shit." I guess someone in the band thought that vibratto wasn't good for the commercial industry.. beats me. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 00:56:22 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Falling Into Infinity Pt.I Message-ID: This is myt take on each of the songs: "New Millenium" I fell in love with the album with the intro and the mega bass that you hear. Roght away I could tell what they(DT) were talking about.They have been talking about being more accesible and remaining the DT we all know and love and they did that. What I mean is tha this album really GROOVES hard.I love the sitar. The change to 6/4 in the bridge and chorus really blows my away. The industrial things going on in the second verse are extremely cool. Someone said that they were dissapointed that they didn't do any of complicated time changes,well all I have to say is that they replaced it with all the groove that they didn't put on the other albums along with shitloads of soul. "You Not Me" I really like this song.Different, but not in a bad way. This is the other side of the DT coin. For all we know ,they may have wanted to write a song like this for Awake or Images and Words.Think about it,this is a really simple song for them to dig in and really GROOVE as a band and not 5 musicians grooving individually in the same song.What I mean is that they wrote and played their parts for the song and not as a showcase of each others talents.This album showcases DT's ability to GROOVE as a band. More to come....... Glen "....And we thank you for your support" Bartles and James ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 00:42:21 -0500 From: Chris Ptacek To: email_address_removed Subject: A New Millenium listening guide Message-ID: ***LONG POST*** Have your cd cued up to listen to ANM, and prepare for some speed reading (or rewinding) The opening: Keys and Stick mesh extremely well here... I am in no hurry to try transcribing this for guitar! You can, however, make out the higher notes on the stick very clearly. Are the bells Portnoy, or Derek? 00:00-00:29 seems Very "dainty" Bass or the low stick strings (likely the latter) appear at 00:29... great syncopation, especially for something in 4/4... maybe syncopation isn't the correct word for it, but the melody twists to make you think it's not actually common time. Count 8th notes along here, while listening to the bass (stick) to see what I mean. 00:36 Cool analog key sound! Really rips your ears open... definitely stands out to me. Drums start to accent things here and there 00:43 Simple guitar comes in, in that "free" style of JP's... I almost expect him to improvise this little section when they play it live... it's the kind of thing he does on songs like Bombay Vindaloo. It wouldn't suprise me if they extended this a bit live... a couple measures to play around in. The drums begin here as well. 00:56 The real rhythm begins... VERY traditional DT guitar... arpeggiated chords, light distortion, and very clear. The guitar melody is sort of an ABAB format, where the B's are clearly doubled an octave up, and seem to sort of "answer" the A measures. Great build in the rhythm section. The drum production sounds awesome--impeccable!--here to me; the cymbals are extremely crisp. Piano takes over for the analog sound on this melody. 1:10 harmony part hops in, keys and guitar. Very Petrucci... good saturated distortion (MESA!). Yet another keyboard patch here... I wonder how hard it is for you key players to switch sounds on stage this frequently! Again, this part could have been on Awake or ACoS. 1:23 Something huge happens here, though it's not a major sonic change. Dream Theater hits on a sound they've never touched before... very powerful. It's like if you've ever gotten in a fight with someone, and you could just tell by the look in their eyes that no matter what Ninjitsu you might know, you're gonna get an ass whuppin'. The guitars are completely wet here... no amp naturally makes this sound... flange/wah/phaser or a combination. 1:37 -7-String- makes itself apparent, and the ass whuppin' begins. Here's something to listen for live... I dunno if they'll be able to emphasize that heavy guitar crunch underneath everything. Do you think they'll sample that sustained chord, or whill Derek play the higher guitar melody on keys? 1:51 Balls and chunk, and some really weird atmospheric effects. Portnoy has a way with the metal on his kit... he must have gone to the Zonder Institute for a few months in DT's off season. 2:08 Vocals! Harmonies, but not what anyone was thinking when they threw the album in, eh? This is completely unlike anything DT has ever done before. This song has had some familiar undercurrents, but overall, so far it's been unexplored ground. I think this is one of the more progressive songs I've heard in a long time. It's evident that they're building up in the song here, and aren't going to repeat this section later. I never noticed how interesting using different music for each verse of a song could be... that's a cool idea. 2:34 Tempo change and mood swing here. The wah guitar takes over with very raw distortion on the melody's first note... I like! The vocals here are much more like what I hear in my head when I think "LaBrie". Another shift in this in this verse, leading to the bridge at 2:46, the big Petrucci 5th chord covering the lower end. 2:51 Da gr00ve-ballz of d00m are moshing across my synapses right now! This sort of reminds me of what would happen if you took an AIC song off _Dirt_ (like maybe Rooster) and played it in double time. This may be a tricky feel for us guitarists to emulate! 3:14 The chorus begins. I think this is one of the catchiest guitar melodies on any Dream Theater song. Something that definitely makes me want to pick up my guitar and play along. Everything else is pretty straightforward. Is this the first time DT has used the word "Baby" in a song? I've always tried to make it a rule never to write that in my own lyrics, right along with things like "Sweet honey-child". At about 3:28 the vocals end and Portnoy throws a china into the rhythm. 3:36 and the Industrial side comes in to scare a lot of ytsejammers off . There's this "Cash register receipt printing" sound whose origins I'm not sure of... keys? Drum trigger? 4:01 New 7 string version of the bridge. The drums are awesome here. Listen to that ride bell, and tell me the drum production sucks... everythings so clear! 4:18 CHUNK CITY pre-chorus. This will sell 7 strings for Ibanez... they should just play this at Guitar Center all day. This may be an new "heaviness pinnacle" for DT. It will incite some serious moshing at the shows (like it or not!). Note the polyrhythm the Portnoy's playing... halfway through (4:26) MP hops back into sync with the rest of the band... one of his trademarks. This song officially kicks my ass. 4:40 Slightly beefed up chorus. This is some pretty intricate drumming here, though it's really subtle. I challenge those of you drummers who call this simple to learn this tune! 4:54 and that rippin' analog synth sounf is back. God bless Korg! 5:14 Is that Mark Zonder or Mike Portnoy?!? (The double bass gives it away shortly). You know the guitar solo has to be coming up when you hear stuff like this, all airy in the middle of a song. 5:42 The drum sticks are clicking like crazy! This rules! Sounds like the Chapman Stick is back here... anyone know if those little wah chords that sound like "Weeoww" are tapped on the stick (listen at 4:47)? Sound a little too strummed, so it may be guitar or a key patch. Pay attention to the toms (5:54 or so) here!!! The guitar is getting a lil funky--some raking techniques, and loose picking. 6:08 the solo melody enters on keys, soon to be joined by guitar. Somewhat reminiscient of TTT to me, somehow. They start to really go all out on this melody and modulate to different keys. Notice the short lead run at 6:55... that's 18+ notes in less than 2 seconds. Petrucci has a way of just "slipping that in". 7:13 Back to the balls n chunk, with a buttload of effects on the mix here. The bass sounds more like Lemmy than Myung (which is sort of a cool switch) They obviously put some effort into not using the "scooped" sound that someone like Dimebag Darrell would use on his tone here. Heavy, and very similar to the earlier chunkage. 7:42 fades out to the chorus. Portnoy's playing around a lot here... pay close attention and you'll hear some Deen Castronovo sounding drum fills. At 8:10 they repeat the opening melody, but with guitar in the mix this time, and finish off. Was it good for you? - CWP ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 23:40:08 -0700 From: Eckie To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: FALLING INTO ???... Message-ID: > Lyrically, there does not appear to be a single ray of > light, hope, > encouragement, positivity or anything edifying or Godly in the entire hour > and twenty minutes; > not even from the usually uplifting Myung. Even the generally harsh > "Awake" album was more > inspiring than Infinity in places! Heh, well, Elektra hasn't been the most supportive record label to our beloved Dream Theater, and niether has eMpTyVee or pop culture for that matter. Hell hath no fury like a musician's scorn for MTV. Then again, you could check the lyrics for New Millennium, they're pretty optimistic...I think? > I don't think you guys know how > much influence you > have on so many people (particularly the highly mercurial, embittered and > rebellious bulk of the > "Generation X"), but it's a serious responsibility to be doing what you > five are doing. > My nipples tell me (what do you say nipples? Speak up, I can't hear you) that music is a form of expression of the musician(s), much like painting/sculpting/writing is for artists, and the only true "responsibility" they have when they create what they do is to stick to thier guns, thier idea, and be able to show the rest of the world thier point of view, in thier light, in thier shade, in thier colors. They may kick much ass as musicians, and they have produced instructional videos and given many a written literature and clinics on how to practice (Petrucci, Myung, and Portnoy, I'm still waiting for the Labrie and Sherinian instructional videos) but deep inside, they're artists, with very critical views of this world we live in. By all means, let 'em be pissed off! I'm only a wee 19 years old but I'm not about to go park a van full of manure in front of Elektra's headquarter building after hearing Just Let Me Breathe. I just wish they included my big ass rantŪ in the liner, or maybe have somebody read it aloud and use it as a sample for Just Let Me Breathe ala Space DIE Vest.... > The darker side of human emotions (pain, frustration, anger, loneliness, > betrayal, doubt, > blah blah blah > though it is not > always particularly easy, such things should always be balanced out in > following songs (which, > sadly, is lacking in Infinity). So...you didn't like Awake? If that album doesn't end on a depressing note....ugh. I always have to replay A Nad Beside Itself right after that last track just to get my spirits back to normal. I'm not depressed when I hear FII, I'm more, imbittered, psyched, ready to kick ass in new ways and show the world, that Kurt Cocaine was not a genius, and that Green Day sucks! ~Conan O' Eckie P.S.- the only pickup you'll ever need....Seymour Duncan's JB Trembucker ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 03:02:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Richard A. Rivera" To: Dream Theater Subject: FII (again) Message-ID: I'm not sure if this went through the first time so if you've read this just hit skip. ------- You know, I came home tonight to ten jams in my inbox and I got to thinking...you know,I just havent seen enough FII reviews. SO....... [I apologize for the lack of apostrophes. That's what you get when you compose off-line and then cut and paste] NM: Definitely the most diverse song on the album, running the gambit between 70s funk and 90s metal, but still maintaining that signature sound that DT is famous for. I didnt know James could sound like this (the verse). Yet another weapon to add to the mans impressive vocal arsenal. I fuckin dig that hook: Ive got this feelin....the tide is turning now baby..... Ive been singing in the shower like you wouldnt believe. And what a instrumental section! Love the funky part where Mike plays on the rim of his drum, while Myung is laying it in the pocket with a funky bass line. But the icing on the cake has got to be JPs porno-style wah-wah. Fuckin classic. Puts a smile on my face every time. Bottom line: a definite change for DT, but it works. YNM: I dont see what everybodys pissed at. It aint that bad. I think most of you are pissed that they used Desmond Child and cant get passed that. While its not necessarily one of my favorites on the album, I can feel it growing on me. Does this song remind anyone else of CiAW? Im not sure why...maybe its the atmospheric keyboard patch during the interludes or the double bass...but for some reason it just screams CiAW to me. Odd, I wasnt crazy about CiAW when I first heard it, but after a while it grew on me just like this one is. Its definitely catchy and will make excellent radio fodder, but I would hardly call it generic. Anybody able to make out what is being said during the end? I havent listened to it with headphones yet. I was kind of expecting the guitar solo to be longer and from them to some sort of complex run together in unison like in Lie. Bottom line: not too bad, and its growing. Probably by the time this message makes it on to the jam it will be one of my favorites. PS- Okay, this was my least favorite song during the Fix shows and while the studio version is a slight improvement, it still is one of my least favorites on the album. It reeks of Pink Floyd and that is not a good thing to me. I just dont like trippy DT. James does sound great on it and the lyrics should lead to some interesting interpretations. There are parts I like (like DSs organ sound), which leads me to compare it to Voices from Awake. That has never been one of my favorites either, though there are some parts that just floor me. Anyway, the song is saved from being a total throw away once the whole band kicks and things get heavy. What a great groove, on par with anything DT has done in the past. I do like the heavier version of the chorus at the end, especially the fast double bass at the end, which is very reminiscent of the end of ACOS. Bottom line: it might grow on me but for now Ill be hitting SKIP. HY: Now THIS is what Im talking about. I would give anything to have been able to come up with this. Love the Spanish guitar sound (eat your heart out Bryan Adams). Arguably the most catchy song since AD. Amazing lyrics. Breath-taking harmonies. James is the fuckin man. Flawless. But the real gem is DSs piano part between the chorus and the verse. If that doesnt make you feel all warm and fuzzy nothing will. Definitely one of my Top 5 DT songs of all time. Bottom line: my favorite on the album. BMS: DT stays true to form with the release of a heavy first single. One of the things that really annoyed me about the Fix version of this was the gang vocals during the call-and-response part of the chorus. Thankfully theyve ditched that and replaced the gang vocals with the talk box. Much more subtle. Love the harmonies on the title. DS -plays with more balls than I thought possible. This song is pure metal, capturing the energy of the live performance. Bottom line: damn fine. HK: Having loved this during the Fix shows, the studio version beats the live version by a knockout. JP really gets to shine on this one. I just love guitar lines that I can sing. Mike is going nuts!!! I love it. And what about that build up? Im going to have to take my shoes off to count that one out. Love the JP-DS runs. Im so glad they didnt lose that element of the sound. Bottom line: not my favorite instrumental by them, but still incredible. LiTS: Im putting my money on this one being the opener for the tour. Just imagine it live: things start of slow, theres a crescendo, and then BAM!!! The band kicks ass for a bit and then breaks it down. James strolls on stage just in time to sing....it could be magical. One of the highlights of this song for me is that sound that DS is using before the verse. Its two hits and they sound like the L.A. Philharmonic got drunk and fell down a flight of stairs. My only complaint with this song is that James is too low in the mix for the first half of the first verse. Its sortta the same thing that happens at the beginning of LSOAD. As far as the Doug issue goes, I love it. Being a moderate Kings X fan, I find he adds a raw, almost gospel tone to the song that James couldnt. I do wish he was mixed a little lower though. And just what the hell is Mike doing underneath the second verse with that cowbell? Is that even human? I love it. Then the song does a 180 and adopts and almost bluesy vibe, reminiscent of parts of the LiT solo in TLF. Then he really lets it rip with some of the most beautiful lead lines in his recorded career. As the song builds back up, does anybody hear similarities between this and the jams the did on the Awake tour? Fuckin killer. Did I mention that this is a lyrical masterpiece as well? I could go on (and I have). Bottom line: a classic TAMP: It really pains me to say this....Im not sold yet. When I first heard this at the Fix shows, I was blown away. What can I say, Im a sucker for a good power ballad. And while this version is okay, I really prefer the original. I mean, the original had power, emotion....I dont know. I think they just went a little overboard in the studio while trying to perfect it. They should have left well enough alone. Its still a damn fine song and I cant wait to hear the demo version (hopefully it will be more true to form). Anyone know why the lyrics were altered? The solo is still moving though. And the chorus was stuck in my head all throughout Poli-Sci today, which is good. Bottom line: the jury is still out JLMB: This is one ass-kicking song! It never lets up. I remember liking this a lot live and the studio version doesnt disappoint at all. Love the groove during the verse. A lot of people are going to hear the disortion on the vocals and cry sell out. But the point of the song is to poke fun at the alternative scene and the music industry. Warrant did a similar thing last year with their song A.Y.M. Again DS and JP get to do their thing. Definitely reminiscent of TTT, but on steroids. As far as the lyrics....sheesh....somebody really had to vent. Bottom line: amazing AL: Oddly, I didnt really like this one the first time I heard it. Thats odd because Im normally sucker for DTs more melodic side. I just didnt get the melody. It was too unexpected, too untraditional to me. But now, with each listen, it gets better and better. It now ranks as one of my favorites on the album. Great lyrics....why dont they let JL write more? CiAW has amazing lyrics and now this...the man is batting a thousand. If given the shot he could possibly fill KMs shoes (let the flames commence). The background vocals are absolutely killer too. I can definitely hear the Queen references with JPs Brian May tone and the dryness of MPs sound too. Bottom: beautiful. ToT: Ill be honest. This is the one song Ive listened to even less than PS. It just hasnt killed me yet. I like parts of it (Its raining....its raining....), but theres something missing. I think I get lost during Deep In Heaven. I start to sort of space out. It doesnt really hold my interest. Thats not to say I dont find it musically challenging. It just doesnt hook me. Great lyrics from Mr. Myung again. Speaking of which, anybody else catch a musical reference to LTL? I wont tell you where since it will lend more credibility to my assertion if other people notice it without having to be pointed to it. Ill give you a hint: its a rhythmic thing. Anyway, it doesnt surprise me that I dont like this one that much right now. It took me literally a couple of years to fully get into LTL..Great solo by DS during Its Raining. My bet is that if they play this in concert they will only play parts of it, like they did with ACOS during the Fix Show. Did anybody else predict a wind sound effect at the beginning of The Wasteland? Bottom line: tempted to say better luck next time, but you never know. Richie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 09:09:46 +0200 From: "Neil Gallop" To: "The Ytsejam Crowd" Subject: Pretty low Message-ID: Hi all Am I the only one around here who thinks it's pretty low of Mr. Portnoy et. al. to poke fun at Shannon Hoon and Kurt Cobain in 'Just Let Me Breath'? I can just imagine the outcry from enraged metal/hard rock fans if somebody did the same to Keith Moon and John Bonham, for example. If they had chosen two people who are still alive, Billy Corgan perhaps, at least they would be able to shoot back if they wanted to. stay safe and happy listening Neil Gallop (nga@software-ag.de) Currently playing: Elend - Lecons De Tenebres ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 3013 **************************