YTSEJAM Digest 2674 Today's Topics: 1) Re: Stupid people are idiots by email_address_removed 2) Rick Bond by "dreamer" 3) re: regarding Angra by (Chung Ng) 4) Re: WASP Two! by email_address_removed 5) Regarding F&J, new stuff, assorted crap, etc.... by Soul Madness 6) Re: regarding Angra by didier goidin 7) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2673 by didier goidin 8) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2672 by didier goidin 9) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2672 by email_address_removed.br (Mário) 10) Spanish-Dubbed Cartoons (NDTC) by Kevin Madden 11) Chopin, Ron Thal by Graeme Nicholson 12) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2673 by The Digital Man 13) NEW album anyone? by Aviad Shkolnikov 14) Ron Thal by Walter Semerenko 15) Re: SF Casino by "LisaMarie Peterson" 16) AAA, 80s Metal, Spicey Stuff by "S. Borzilleri" 17) The Saga Continues ...... by Mark Metzger 18) ProgDay '97 news by Walter Semerenko ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 04:52:10 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Stupid people are idiots Message-ID: >Subject: Stupid people are idiots That's kind of redundant: it's like saying prog fans are analytical, or Ytsejammers are dorks. >Right before we switched 'em though, a "customer service representative" >aka Twatboy came over and asked us how we were doing. Vince = prog dork #1, Eckie = prog dork #2 ;) >Then again, Alternative will be dead in a couple months, won't it? >:) And prog rock will never get beyond where it is now (which is the way some people around here want it). We should be at the end of the electronica phase of popular music by then. 5 nifty CDs: 1.) Helmet- Aftertaste 2.) Helmet- Betty 3.) Helmet- Strap It On 4.) Joshua Redman- Freedom In The Groove 5.) Sometimes God Hides (Discipline Global sampler with Crimson, Fripp, Levin, California Guitar Trio, Belew, etc.) Jack ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 01:03:44 +0200 From: "dreamer" To: "ytsejam" Subject: Rick Bond Message-ID: <199706280948.LAA09071@cww.de> Hello, Rick, if you read this, please drop me a line. Thanx. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 97 6:37:50 EDT From: (Chung Ng) To: Subject: re: regarding Angra Message-ID: >There is also "Reaching Horizons" which is their 6-song demo > + 3 bonus tracks. > >Isn't it a bootleg ?I thought it was... There was a 6-song demo on tape which was floating around. My CD looks "real" - produced by Angra, lyric sheets, 16-page insert, etc...very "real"-looking. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 07:37:23 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: WASP Two! Message-ID: "BTW anyone know the WASP album released after TCI - I can't remember its name .... apparently it was also good ... but not quite in the same league." two albums after tci: still not black enough - very good but not quite as good as tci kill fuck die - hasn't quite grown on me yet ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 97 09:07 EDT From: Soul Madness To: email_address_removed Subject: Regarding F&J, new stuff, assorted crap, etc.... Message-ID: For the person asking about the new Flotsam And Jetsam disc, it is a lot heavier almost like Doomsday style music. New Motley Crue- Generation Swine I don't really care for this album at all. Apparently the band has no creativity left in them and decided to take the chicken shit way out and just release something that will appeal to Nine Inch Nails fans. While songs like the ballad "Glitter" and "Shout At The Devil '97" do have a lot to offer, there isn't much else. "Let Us Prey" is an amazing song but you can tell that John Corabi wrote it and that its a left-over from the last album- in fact, it would've sounded better had John been singing it. The worst song on here is "Brandon"- the lyrics are just plain and simple, pathedic. I've seen Silverchair write better lyrics. Crap like Brandon, you are my son and I love you. Who are they writing for? The fans or their kids and wives. Lesson learned: the band should've kept John- he had the voice and the music on Motley Crue's self-titled album was the best ever. The Nixons: The Nixons Hey, I have a thing for some alternative music and while this album in no way matches up to Foma, it sure does beat the hell out of a lot of other alternative shit. For those who don't believe, check out "Shine" (yes, the song title is overused), a cool ballad clocking in at 7 minutes with an extended trumpet solo at the end. Another great track to check out is "Screaming Yellow" which was written about high school bullies and good shit like that. Also, the new bass player makes an impression on you- believe me, you can hear the bass on this album. New Dream Theater- September 23 of what year???? Wondering if anyone else got a chance to watch Jerry Maguire and what they thought of it...to me, parts of it were lame but overall, it was an okay movie. I'm done rambling........................................................Don ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 16:59:55 +0200 (MET DST) From: didier goidin To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: regarding Angra Message-ID: >There is also "Reaching Horizons" which is their 6-song demo + 3 bonus >tracks. > I think the highlight is the "speed" version of "Wuthering Heights". I got >all of their EPs are available for $12 each (from DreamDisc). Does anyone >know what is on "Evil Warning"? On this Ep, there are Evil warning ('edit version') and carry on, angels crying and time (these versions are the ones on angels cry second edition) actually, the first edition of angels cry was only release in japan (end 94 without ricardo confessori on drums), and angra rerecorded new versions of 'carry on, angels crying and time' for the world release of angels cry (summer 95) the original versions are on the reaching horizons ep just notice that in france, holy land was release with 3 accoustic songs in may 96, 2 tracks cd single in four part was release in france (make believe as edit with on I: make believe (album version) II: wutherings height (edit) III: never understand (accoustic) IV: "i don't remember sorry" angra recorded an accoustic version of make believe which is only available with a french magazine called HARD FORCE ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 17:02:20 +0200 (MET DST) From: didier goidin To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2673 Message-ID: >>There is also "Reaching Horizons" which is their 6-song demo + 3 bonus >>tracks. > > Isn't it a bootleg ?I thought it was... this is not a LMB product but angra approved it so.... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 17:08:44 +0200 (MET DST) From: didier goidin To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2672 Message-ID: >"Freedom Call"-1-"Freedom Call" > 2-"Queen Of The Night (remixed version)"-the original >version >is in their demo tape "Reahing Horizons" > 3-"Reaching Horizons"-from their demo tape > 4-"Stand Away (orchestral version)" > 5-"Painkiller"-from Judas Priest tribute > 6-"Deep Blue (edit version)"Land" album > There 2 bonus tracks in the Brazilian version-"Angels >Cry" >and "Never Understand",both Live Acoustic verions of the songs.... > > Mario where Live Acoustic versions have been recorded (maybe these versions are the same one of holy land: Fnac in paris) thanks didier ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 11:38:24 -0300 From: email_address_removed.br (Mário) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2672 Message-ID: >where Live Acoustic versions have been recorded (maybe these versions are >the same one of holy land: Fnac in paris) Yes,these and the "Holy Land" bonus cd versions are the same,recorded at FNAC, May 1995... Mario ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 12:01:47 -0700 From: Kevin Madden To: email_address_removed Subject: Spanish-Dubbed Cartoons (NDTC) Message-ID: ARGH! I feel your pain, Ernie. Not with the Tick, per se, as I never watched that, but I remember trying to watch the Simpsons in Spanish, and the voices blew. I always had this image of a 90-year old drunk guy doing the voices out of a garbage can studio somewhere in an alley of Mexico City. As for translations, you are so right, but I noticed them more in the print comics. Poor "Hagar" became "Olafo" who the hell are the "Picapiedra?" I think "los flintstone" would have sounded fine. But, even faithful translations sometimes are losers. There just isn't the same ring to "el raton Mickey" .... I know this is so jam-related! Anybody forking out the 50 bucks for the fight tonight? I just can't do it. What if it lasts 2 minutes? I am constantly reminded of the flick, "The Great White Hype." I think that was a boxing documentary. Now Playing: Voivod - Negatron Detroit Red Wings - 1996-97 Stanley Cup Champions Kevin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 17:10:36 +0100 From: Graeme Nicholson To: email_address_removed Subject: Chopin, Ron Thal Message-ID: >Otherwise, can anyone tell me where I could find Petrucci's transcription >of Chopin's Etude #2? I heard it was in three or four installments of his >column in Guitar World. Yeh, I got the first 64 notes down on paper and >found myself wondering if there was an easier way to transcribe it... I would also be VERY into getting this transciption. If someone has it, or has a web address for it, please throw it my way. >Ron Thal is sick. If you like sick guitar, check him out. When Steve Vai >has nightmares, they feature music by Ron Thal. I haven't experienced such >an uncanny manifestation of my thoughts since I saw the movie "Seven." I remember hearing his 8-track demo and waiting for Bumblefoot to come out. Ron is seriously cool: HE read something I wrote on a newsgroup about him and HE e-mailed ME! Usually these things happen the other way around! We started talking regularly, he was telling me about the problems he's been having with Shrapnel and Varney, and later he e-mailed me samples of his Hermit album long before it hit the stores! Because I get a rush out of the weirder stuff (Buckethead, Praxis) I think that's why Ron's music appeals to me so much. He has obscenely good technical abiltiy but makes music that is extremely listenable, while doing wholetone and atonal things. And what about that bonus Bumblefoot track?! "Thanks for the fire debris, what a flavor it has!" +----------------------- Graeme Nicholson | work t: 01202 299900 x260 PLAY+ Magazine | work e: silencio@paragon.co.uk --------------------+ home e: lbgn@easynet.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 12:14:34 -0400 (EDT) From: The Digital Man To: A Pleasant Shade of Ytse Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2673 Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Jun 1997 email_address_removed wrote: > YTSEJAM Digest 2673 Wow, my first digest since... March? April? Yippee. :) ---- > From: Ack! > Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2672 > > How do I get off this mailing list??? Well, the first step in the process is a long, complicated dance, not dissimilar to the mating rituals of the N'Zgrfth of southern Paraguay. (Look it up.) After that, you have to chant the holy lemmas of St. Bafu, in reverse order, starting with #412. Finally, you must climb the Green Monster in Boston's Fenway Park (no, not Nomar Garciaparra, the wall in left field) and throw spitballs at Skadz' window until he acknowledges that you have been successfully unsubscribed (you *do* read smoke signals, right?). Of course, you could just READ THE FUCKING FAQ. It might be in there. ---- > From: email_address_removed (Ernesto Schnack) > Subject: Marillion, Maiden, Tick > > >1) bootleg > > by D > > Hey! One D is more than enough on this list, ya hear? ;) Yeah! (Hey, did you know that there's some impostor on the NMS calling himself The Digital Man? Let's go kick his ass!) > On a sadder note... they've suddenly decided to show the Tick w/o SAP here. > That means I have to see it in spanish. It's still funny, but they give him Stuff like that is *funnier* in Spanish, if ya ask me. My parents recently got a tv with that SAP stuff (it even has a remote control!) and channel 5 in nyc plays the Simpsons in Spanish over the sap. It's pretty amusing. :) Factoid of the day: "D'oh!" in Spanish is "D'oh!". ---- > From: "S. Borzilleri" > Subject: Rumors, Chopin, Release Date > > Ron Thal is sick. If you like sick guitar, check him out. When Steve Vai > has nightmares, they feature music by Ron Thal. I haven't experienced such > an uncanny manifestation of my thoughts since I saw the movie "Seven." I'm afraid to ask, but... no, forget it. I don't want to know. > Bafu Vai > > ------------------------------ > End of YTSEJAM Digest 2673 > ************************** Did this happen a lot when I was in ack mode? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Digital Man \|/ ____ \|/ Secretary & Webmaster email_address_removed "@'/ ,. \`@" UVM Comp Sci Student Assn email_address_removed /_| \__/ |_\ "He won't need a bed http://www.emba.uvm.edu/~cmerlo \__U_/ He's a digital man" - Peart ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Maintainer of the Official Dream Theater Frequently Asked Questions List http://www.emba.uvm.edu/~cmerlo/dtfaq.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 97 14:15 +0200 From: Aviad Shkolnikov To: email_address_removed Subject: NEW album anyone? Message-ID: Hi people! Can anyone please tell me about when the new album is coming out? Or maybe (god forbid) is it already out? Thanks! - Aviad ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 14:52:00 +0000 From: Walter Semerenko To: email_address_removed Subject: Ron Thal Message-ID: >I remember hearing his 8-track demo and waiting for Bumblefoot to come out. >Ron is seriously cool: HE read something I wrote on a newsgroup about him >and HE e-mailed ME! Usually these things happen the other way around! We >started talking regularly, he was telling me about the problems he's been >having with Shrapnel and Varney, and later he e-mailed me samples of his >Hermit album long before it hit the stores! I have the _Hermit_ album and it is like a good technical Alice in Chains band. "Don't Play the Blues" has an insane solo. Walter. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 12:13:43 PDT From: "LisaMarie Peterson" To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: SF Casino Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Jun 1997, Rick Audet wrote: >Dingdingding! I finally hit the jackpot. Owning all this vinyl must >reveal my age. At least I'm not as old as Lisa Marie! :P >Rick Audet >Dolby Labs /me kicks Rick in the butt. ;oP Hey! You're not that far behind me bud. Sorry NDTC... so sue me :o> Lisa Marie ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' ".`^~,^. __ _ '._',_.; Lisa Marie Peterson \ \ ___ ___ ___(_) ___ ( \/ ) email_address_removed \ \/ _ \/ __/ __| |/ _ \ \ / /\_/ / __/\__ \__ \ | __/ \/ \___/ \___||___/___/_|\___| http://members.wbs.net/homepages/j/e/s/jessiebannon.html ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 12:18:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "S. Borzilleri" To: Dream Vespres Subject: AAA, 80s Metal, Spicey Stuff Message-ID: > From: Adam Barnhart > Subject: Deutchland Uber Alles > > Now there's that AAA music now (Adult Album Alternative), which is the > intersection of Nanci Griffith, Tori Amos, Pearl Jam, and Blues > Traveler. Some of that stuff (all of the bands I listed, anyhow) is > actually quite good. Some of it appeals to me somewhat less. VH-1, > which has adapted something of an AAA format in recent years, is > actually a more interesting listening experience than MTV now, which has > become fairly monochromatic. VH-1 never had gameshows or stories about people floundering around in real life all recorded for your viewing pleasure. ;) Not that "Remote Control" wasn't quality television, I mean where would Cari Wuhrer be if not for that show? And didn't she set the precedent for future hostesses like Jenny McCarthy and Carmen Elektra? Aha? AHAAA??? See the domino effect now? Cari Wuhrer once said that the solo from "Little Fighter" by White Lion "has got to be the coolest guitar solo in the world." But that isn't why I learnt it, your honor. Wanna stump people who claim to be "open to all forms of music" ? People who say "I don't have a favorite, my cd collection has music from all styles" ? People who say, "I'm completely open-minded when it comes to music" ? People who say "There's not really a type of music I can't listen to" ? One word: Slaughter. The Band. Whip it out. Sure, Mr. World Music likes Wu-Tang AND Harry Connick Jr. ALL AT THE SAME TIME. But can he stomach a little "Up All Night?" Can YOU? Over the last two months I've picked up albums by Joan Osborne, Sheryl Crow, Tracy Chapman, Tracy Bonham, Jewel, and Paula Cole. I ask you, Women of the Ytsejam, can the sexist prick be shedding his skin??? (okay, so I willingly passed on Meredith Brooks, and McLachlan's new one isn't out until July 15th, get a rope already!) ---- > From: "Eric LaRue" > Subject: I am going to commit treason here. > > What does everyone have against the Spice Girls? I mean, sure, they're > nothing to worship or anything, but they're not as horrible as > everyone's making them out to be. I'm an advocate so far. And I don't even have their album. (hey! another one to wipe out my sexist prickishness! I wonder if Tower has any left...) > BTW, what's this about a rumor that one of the Spice Girls used to be a > Spice Guy? Yeah, her name was Derek something. Some kind of stone, like maybe Derek Obsidian. Almost time to Face-Off... Bafu Vai ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 15:45:29 -0400 From: Mark Metzger To: "'(ytsejam)'" Subject: The Saga Continues ...... Message-ID: OK, this is sad. It is really hard to push "the goods". Seemed like such a great deal. But no (serious) responses. I feel like I couldn't sell a hooker on a troop train. In fact, this commodity is beginning to resemble the inlaw who just wont leave. I am sick to fucking death of seeing this commodity in my humble abode and have decided to do something about it. If you know what the goods are, they can be yours for "Completely Free". Rhymes with Completely Labrie. If you know what the commodity is and really do want it, send me an e-mail with the *complete* description of the item and I will mail it to you. That's right, no $8, no stupid BS about being kind to people, no paying for the damned mailer, no paying for the damned postage. That's right, I will spend hard earned money out of my pocket to get it out of my sight. US only (with apologies to our friendly non-US jammers). Completely free, gratis, tres buenos. You get the idea. First e-mail gets it. Later, Mark Metzger email_address_removed PS - Trevor eats worms........:) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 15:47:07 +0000 From: Walter Semerenko To: email_address_removed Subject: ProgDay '97 news Message-ID: Hi everyone, I just wanted to post some information about this progressive rock festival. I went to this festival last year hardly knowing any of the bands that played. I went not expecting much, and came back as a converted Prog Freak. This festival really brought out my love for progressive music. My prog IQ increase immensely in two days just by chatting with people. The festival organizer, Peter Renfro, has a heart for promoting progressive music. I seen the lengths thisman has gone to do it. Last year the attendance was 200, and he expected it to be doubled from the year before. It was a hell of a show showcasing bands from different countries Deus ex Machina (Italy), Ars Nova (Japan), Galadriel (Spain), Cast (Mexico). Peter has lost a lot of money putting this show together, but luckily he recouped his losses and is putting one this year. If you want to see progressive music grow, come out to the festival. Already in the prog festival in Los Angeles (ProgFest), the LA Times featured an article on it. Going to the festival can be expensive. Last year, I took a plane and was barely old enough to rent a car (I'm 21) and nearly maxed out my credit card. Peter was gracious enough to provide me a spot of his living room floor (what a man!). If you would like to go, but money is a problem them email me personally and we can arrange something. Ok, enough...here's the info. ProgDay '97 is now official! Here's the lineup: SATURDAY AUGUST 30th SUNDAY AUGUST 31st French TV Smokin' Granny Salem Hill After the Fall Ozone Quartet (fka Cloud Nine) Volare Providence Finisterre David Ragsdale Finneus Gauge Discipline WHERE IN THE WORLD IS MARILLION? Marillion's American booking agency has decided ProgDay is not in the best interests of the band. Strangely, they do feel it is in the best interests to duplicate the 'Afraid of Sunlight' tour route...the same route which lost so much money! Is it a wonder that Marillion has never broken the American market? (not saying that ProgDay would have done that....just the attitude of the booking agency leaves much to be desired in my opinion) As a side note, I also approached Fish about doing the show. Although we could not fit the show into his schedule (he'll be on the West Coast at the time), Little Big Man Productions and Jim Pitulski in particular were very cordial, and they even knew what progressive rock was! ADMISSION: $25 per day or $45 for the weekend pass (pass is only available through advance order). Tickets will be mailed out the first or second week or August. You can pay for tickets by check or credit card. Checks payable to Peter Renfro and sent to: 207 South Elliott Road, Chapel Hill, NC 27514. For Visa and Mastercard orders please call me at A-Z Mailing Services (919) 968-1181. During business hours I will only be able to take your information...after 6:00pm EST I might be able to answer questions. Note that the charges will appear as 'A-Z Mailing Services' on your credit card statement. LOCATION: ProgDay '97 will be held Saturday August 30 and Sunday August 31, 1997. The location will be the same as last year: beautiful and scenic Storybook Farm in Chapel Hill, NC. Come see what has been called "the Woodstock of Prog"! WEBPAGE: The official ProgDay webpage has moved. Please note the new address: http://www.hrzdata.com/progday/ THE BANDS FRENCH TV-This band from Kentucky has their own unique brand of music and sense of humor. Their covers of Van Der Graaf Generator and Nektar songs hardly relate to their own compositions. Industrial and techno are somehow weaved into the world of complex fusion-prog that have built them a cult following over the past decade and they are sure to start the day off right! SALEM HILL-This Tennessee-based band has just released their 4th album (first to be on CD). 'Catatonia' will instantly remind listeners of Marillion's 'Brave', but as this concept album progresses you will hear them forge their own style of melodic prog. Salem Hill's previous album 'The Robbery of Murder' earned them cult reputation; 'Catatonia' brings them into the same playing field as Iluvatar. Special guest Dave Ragsdale on violin! http://www.salemhill.com VOLARE-Hailing from Georgia, there is a lot of anticipation about their upcoming album to be released by The Laser's Edge. Their style blends heavy fusion with stylings that have drawn comparisons to Hatfield and the North. This band has created a unique style that hasn't been heard in America since perhaps Happy the Man. OZONE QUARTET-The name may look weird, but the faces will be familiar. This is actually Cloud Nine, but due to copyright laws, we have to get used to Ozone Quartet! Their first CD is slated to come out later this summer. They've replaced their guitarist and they're hotter than ever. Expect fusion overload as violin and Stick interweave with guitars and drums. At times melodically soothing, and other times discordant and driving. http://www.gncs.com/music/bands/cloud9/c9.html PROVIDENCE-Remember Arsnova? Well, Providence proves that there's more to Japan than sushi! This band has earned a reputation for being one of the best live prog bands in Japan and their newest CD "Choko-Muro" is Japanese prog at its finest. Reviewers often compare this band to Renaissance (just like every other band with a female vocalist!), but I see more influeces from early Marillion and melodic heavy metal in their music. DAVID RAGSDALE-Formerly the violin player for Kansas, this talented multi- instrumentalist has branched out on his own with his first solo release 'David and Goliath'. Never content with just one style, Ragsdale's material should appeal to fans of Brand X, Mahuvishnu Orchestra, Kansas and even John Tesh (!). David has put together a band specifically for ProgDay, so this might be your only chance to see this material live! SMOKIN' GRANNY-This local band features former members of Freehand...but expect something more along the lines of Soft Machine. Two guitars, bass, drums, and saxophone--a potentially deadly combination! AFTER THE FALL-These guys call themselves neo-prog, but that's sometimes hard to believe when they belt out a 15-minute instrumental! The vocalist reminds me of Greg Lake at times, but the lyrics are much better. :) Expect a powerhouse of prog from this talented trio! :) http://www.moonsite.com/atf FINISTERRE-This Italian group has generated a lot of interest on r.m.p. On a recent discussion of bands people most wanted to see, Finisterre popped up more than any other band! Their music combines pastoral moods and complex arrangements to create some of the most original prog music to come out of Italy since PFM. http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/stage/4624 FINNEUS GAUGE-Prog and fusion meld seamlessly with this new American band. Their first release 'More Once More' has been highly anticipated by the prog community and advance word says this band delivers the goods! Expect some top-notch keyboard-driven vocal fusion. http://www.webcom.com/qghost/finneus.html DISCIPLINE-If ProgDay has anything like a 'house' band, then these guys are it. Their new CD "Unfolded Like Staircase" is set for release in early July and I predict it will make some waves. Their style combines passionate vocals and off-beat melodies to create some highly original progressive rock that explores the dark pyche. To recieve the rest of the info, contact Peter Renfro at email_address_removed to be put on the mailing list. Walter. ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 2674 **************************