YTSEJAM Digest 2522 Today's Topics: 1) Re: Metallica's Houston Show - Many Problems! by email_address_removed (Evicerator) 2) =?iso-8859-1?Q?Queensr=FFche=2Dtour?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?_?= by Brian Henderson 3) New DT material by Loren Caler 4) Metallica by Soul Madness 5) Re: New DT material by Anton Max 6) Re: New DT material by Anton Max 7) Re: New DT material by Carlos Alfaro 8) One Week! (NDTC) by "Bruce D. Duesterhoeft" 9) by email_address_removed (dex) 10) where has music gone? by email_address_removed (Ryan M Vance) 11) Re: YTSEJAM digest 2520 by email_address_removed.ca (Gordon McFee) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 19:06:24 -0700 (MST) From: email_address_removed (Evicerator) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Metallica's Houston Show - Many Problems! Message-ID: hehe you been fooled ;) This is the same damn choreographed BS they've done all across the country. Don't feel special ;) >Ahoy, > > First of all, I did not attend the show.... these are the stories from >about five folks at school who did.... > > Metallica performed with C.O.C. opening last night at the Summit. >Apparently it was the most unintentionally messed up show people had seen >in a while... simply by bad luck there were apparently a lot of electrical >problems....=20 > > 1. A fire began on stage with some electrical wiring on the intersection >of the catwalk between the two main stages.... > > 2. The PA went haywire and the amps went whack and began distorting all of >the instrument and vocal sounds.... the tech crew had to bring out a bunch >of combo amps for the band... after this it wasn't quite as loud and the >sound was of a lesser quality. > > 3. (Here's the good one) A very large techman in a crow's nest fell out >holding a broken, sparking, power line. On his way down he swung into 3 >guitars knocking them over and across the stage, and then lost his grip and >hit the stage really hard... this was apparently not staged as James >stopped playing and pointed saying "what the fuck?" ... the paramedics ran >out and began attending to the man. > > 4. After bringing out the combos, the band only played one more song, >"Motorbreath", and then quit because of the shit going on.... James walked >back to the mike and goes "We'll fuckin see you later" and walked out.... > > > Like I said, I wasn't actually there... but hearing this from several >sources was enough to convince me.... sounds like they had a pretty bad >time.... I'd be pissed as hell if I was in a band that big that had been >touring so many times and something like that went on.... just thought I'd >share this. > =20 > =B7 =95 Colonel Mustard = =95 =B7 > > =20 *** Megadeth's new "Cryptic Writings" will be released June 17 *** = =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D\\ "As a child, I thought I could live without pain; ,---,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,\ without sorrow. |\ /. |' | But as a man, I've found it's all caught up= with=20 ||. \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ | me . . .I'm alseep, yet I'm so afraid..." ||| . \ | -John Petrucci ||| . . \| \ ||| .,,,,,,,,,,/| ' ___ ___ _________ _________|\ |||< | | |V| /|.' />-. ,- >< | ||\\/,/ / , / |* ,,,,,,,. /. |/_\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ ; '^_\_/ /--'___\- To: email_address_removed Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Queensr=FFche=2Dtour?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?_?= Message-ID: Tuesday, August 5th QR's scheduled to play the Mann Music Center in Philadelphia, PA, according to the Screaming in Digital page. On the TicketBastard website, it looks as if the tix have already gone on sale. Yet, when I called the local vendor (West Coast Video) today, they didn't even have record of the show. Does anybody know the lowdown on what goindown? Brian Henderson, Cyberburlapatarium email_address_removed "Uncle's got the damn lice again..." -- customer, GIANT, yesterday ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 19:52:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Loren Caler To: email_address_removed Subject: New DT material Message-ID: PLEASE TAKE THE TIME (NO PUN INTENDED) TO READ THIS AND BE AWARE THAT I AM A DIE HARD DT FAN! Thanx. Well I am currently listining to the new DT songs that were put up as RealAudio on www.gmsnet.com/progmetal. Raise The Knife: Oh boy.....I'm REALLY scared here. I HOPE TO GOD that it's just the SHITTY recording in MONO that makes them sound that bad, but this has to be the WORST song I have ever heard come out of DT. Mike Portny's work is REALLY poor on this one, and the song just doesn't flow together well at ALL. I really feel like I'm commiting suicide when I say something like that, but it's my honest opinion. I hope that all they're new stuff is not like this. Shit, I hope this one DOES NOT make the final cut. Sorry.....:(. Tears: WHAT??!?!?! DT does a 3 minute song? What happened here? Is it not finished.....no it ended. Uh oh....It's nice, but nothing like TSM. Hmmm....what's the deal here? Where Are You Now?: Initial Reaction....alternative???? Where is the prog? Oh god help me....this sounds like it's coming right off the radio. This is most likely going to be the single they will put out. It's got all the trademarks of radioish material. Catchy chorus, chig-ga chig-ga guitar parts (did you get that?). And again MP is straight forwrd here. Well I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO sorry to say that I am VERY disappointed in these clips. Now I realize that this could be like a rehersal or something and they'll add to it later, but these sound pretty complete to me. And I AM NOT saying that DT should always be pulling out I & W style songs, but these just don't sound like them at all. Before you flame me and start to say things like, "Why the hell are you on this list if all you can do is rag on them?", get the files off www.gmsnet.com/progmetal and listen to it for yourself and decide. They are under the progmetal button on the web page. Actually these clips sound like a bad dubbing of a demo tape because on the end of WAYN you can hear it being stopped. Well anyways I'm eager to hear what others have to say. Later, I-Van ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 97 23:05 EDT From: Soul Madness To: email_address_removed Subject: Metallica Message-ID: > 1. A fire began on stage with some electrical wiring on the intersection >of the catwalk between the two main stages.... When I went and saw Metallica, this also happened but it was staged. If you tell me they had some guy running around on fire, it was most likely staged. > > 3. (Here's the good one) A very large techman in a crow's nest fell out >holding a broken, sparking, power line. On his way down he swung into 3 >guitars knocking them over and across the stage, and then lost his grip and >hit the stage really hard... this was apparently not staged as James >stopped playing and pointed saying "what the fuck?" ... the paramedics ran >out and began attending to the man. This never happened at the concert I went to but something close to it happened. A guy was running around on stage on fire and they had paramedics come out and the band stopped playing but it was all staged once again. Who knows, maybe this was real??? 4. After bringing out the combos, the band only played one more song, >"Motorbreath", and then quit because of the shit going on.... James walked >back to the mike and goes "We'll fuckin see you later" and walked out.... > You got me here- I doubt this was staged because I don't think the band would do that unless they are complete assholes. Don email_address_removed http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/5784 ...so many times, I tried and failed to gather my courage reach again for that nail, life's been like dragging feet through sand and never finding the promised land.... Queensryche- Promised Land ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 23:48:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Anton Max To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: New DT material Message-ID: On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Loren Caler wrote: > PLEASE TAKE THE TIME (NO PUN INTENDED) TO READ THIS AND BE AWARE THAT I AM A > DIE HARD DT FAN! Thanx. > Please take the time to turn off your caps lock. Thanx. :) > > Well I am currently listining to the new DT songs that were put up > as RealAudio on www.gmsnet.com/progmetal. > > > Raise The Knife: > > Oh boy.....I'm REALLY scared here. I HOPE TO GOD that it's just the SHITTY > recording in MONO that makes them sound that bad, but this has to be the If it's the same RA file I heard a while back, I don't think you can really judge it at all. I just couldn't hear *anything* on that. There could be all kinds of stuff going on that just comes oout as a blob of noise. > > Tears: > > WHAT??!?!?! DT does a 3 minute song? What happened here? Is it not > finished.....no it ended. Uh oh....It's nice, but nothing like TSM. > Hmmm....what's the deal here? > Haven't heard it. I really liked Wait for Sleep though...the last really short DT song. > > Where Are You Now?: > > Initial Reaction....alternative???? Where is the prog? Oh god help > me....this sounds like it's coming right off the radio. This is most likely > going to be the single they will put out. It's got all the trademarks of > radioish material. Catchy chorus, chig-ga chig-ga guitar parts (did you get > that?). And again MP is straight forwrd here. > I think I heard this one, and wasn't terribly impressed with it. But I only heard it once. > Well I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO sorry to say that I am VERY disappointed in these > clips. Now I realize that this could be like a rehersal or something and > they'll add to it later, but these sound pretty complete to me. And I AM > NOT saying that DT should always be pulling out I & W style songs, but these > just don't sound like them at all. Take heart. The stuff I heard them play at the Providence show was much more DT-ish than what you describe. Lines in the Sand was so progressive I couldn't follow it and don't remember any of it at all, which makes for a poor first impression but good potential. Peruvian Skies was also progressive and very good, Burning My Soul and Just Let me Breathe were both shorter (actually I just checked the DT page and BMS is 9 minutes long, much longer than I remember it being), but had a good edge to them along the lines of the heavier stuff from Awake. Take Away My Pain didn't do anything for me, unfortunately. I'm not totally crazy about all the new material, but I don't think it'll be as bad as you fear. Trial of Tears, according to the webpage, is 12:30 long, so maybe what you heard is just a second of it (unless what you heard was not Trial of Tears but a cover of Rush's Tears maybe?) Anyway, there are a lot of songs listed at http://www.rsabbs.com/dt/whatsnew.html that look pretty long, and I can't imagine DT trying to sustain a boring song for more than 5 minutes...they've never done it before... and besides, someday Metropolis part II will be released, and it's half an hour long and you KNOW it's got something to live up to, so even if the new album blows chunks, we'll still have that to look forward to. -maximilian Anton Max MadMax+@cmu.edu http://thunderdome.pc.cs.cmu.edu/aepithex.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:05:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Anton Max To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: New DT material Message-ID: On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Anton Max wrote: > > > Tears: > > > > WHAT??!?!?! DT does a 3 minute song? What happened here? Is it not > > finished.....no it ended. Uh oh....It's nice, but nothing like TSM. > > Hmmm....what's the deal here? > > > I'm not totally crazy about all the new material, but I don't think it'll > be as bad as you fear. Trial of Tears, according to the webpage, is 12:30 > long, so maybe what you heard is just a second of it (unless what you > heard was not Trial of Tears but a cover of Rush's Tears maybe?) > Yep. I just downloaded it. It's a Rush song. -maximilian Anton Max MadMax+@cmu.edu http://thunderdome.pc.cs.cmu.edu/aepithex.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:07:22 -0400 From: Carlos Alfaro To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: New DT material Message-ID: Anton Max wrote: > > > Tears: > > > > WHAT??!?!?! DT does a 3 minute song? What happened here? Is it not > > finished.....no it ended. Uh oh....It's nice, but nothing like TSM. > > Hmmm....what's the deal here? > > > Haven't heard it. I really liked Wait for Sleep though...the last really > short DT song. tears is a rush song... if the chorus goes "what would touch me deeper..the tears that fall blablah..its the rush song.. most likely it is "At the edge of chaos, unexpected outcomes occur. The risk to survival is severe." Ian Malcolm http://premium.caribe.net/~calfaro mailto:email_address_removed mailto:email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:36:18 -0400 From: "Bruce D. Duesterhoeft" To: YtseGods Subject: One Week! (NDTC) Message-ID: One week til the new Magellan comes out. "Test Of Wills" With a 'real live' drummer it should kick ASS! I'll be getting mine Monday Night! Later Bruce Duesterhoeft ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:43:34 -0500 From: email_address_removed (dex) To: email_address_removed Message-ID: > >Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 16:22:29 -0500 >From: email_address_removed (Mark Lampert) >To: >Subject: Metallica's Houston Show - Many Problems! >Message-ID: > >Ahoy, > > First of all, I did not attend the show.... these are the stories from >about five folks at school who did.... > > Metallica performed with C.O.C. opening last night at the Summit. >Apparently it was the most unintentionally messed up show people had seen >in a while... simply by bad luck there were apparently a lot of electrical >problems.... > > 1. A fire began on stage with some electrical wiring on the intersection >of the catwalk between the two main stages.... > > 2. The PA went haywire and the amps went whack and began distorting all of >the instrument and vocal sounds.... the tech crew had to bring out a bunch >of combo amps for the band... after this it wasn't quite as loud and the >sound was of a lesser quality. > > 3. (Here's the good one) A very large techman in a crow's nest fell out >holding a broken, sparking, power line. On his way down he swung into 3 >guitars knocking them over and across the stage, and then lost his grip and >hit the stage really hard... this was apparently not staged as James >stopped playing and pointed saying "what the fuck?" ... the paramedics ran >out and began attending to the man. > > 4. After bringing out the combos, the band only played one more song, >"Motorbreath", and then quit because of the shit going on.... James walked >back to the mike and goes "We'll fuckin see you later" and walked out.... > > > Like I said, I wasn't actually there... but hearing this from several >sources was enough to convince me.... sounds like they had a pretty bad >time.... I'd be pissed as hell if I was in a band that big that had been >touring so many times and something like that went on.... just thought I'd >share this. > > … ï Colonel Mustard ï … HuH? kinda funny the same thing happened when I saw them two months ago, and for that matter it has hapened each and every time metallica has taken to the stage for the "on the load again" tour. It supposedly is the bands way of mocking when jaymz got burnt up by the pyro during the GnR/Met tour a few years back. Funny thing was that when i saw them there were alot of people there who actually believed that it was really happening! The band has even boasted about it in interviews that their little "accident" costs them a shitLOAD of money and that if they break even on this tour that they will be lucky. Actually i beilieve this was even posted here once before so I guess I'll somehow be flamed for resurging an old post but what the hell do I care Im quite sure people are still pissed at me for posting that lightbulb thing. apparently I pissed a few people off but they will have to get over it. Well thats all for now, Layterz dex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 00:49:35 EDT From: email_address_removed (Ryan M Vance) To: email_address_removed Subject: where has music gone? Message-ID: hey thre all, >Not overly exciting, but these are not the kind of people that I would think >know a band like DT even exists. Maybe with a lttle push, they could one day >have the widespread appeal of, say, Bush. :) The new bands of the 90's are just plain lame. the majority of them are a drummer who can play 8th notes. ooo wow! then we have the amazing bassist who can copy the guitarist perfectly but couldn't play something on their own if their life depended on it and then the ever so lame guitarist who bought a guitar, learned three chords and then said "hey, i'll start a band! then he writes songs by using the same three chords in as many different orders he could possibly come up with. these wonderful "alternitive" bands are then thought to be the best thing that ever happened to the music industry. i thought you had to have "talent" and practice and actually be able to write music. it's so nice to have bands like dt that have got it together and have musicians that really kick ass. i just wish that other people could figure it out. thought i'd give my 2 cents, -ryan email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 02:55:41 -0400 (EDT) From: email_address_removed.ca (Gordon McFee) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 2520 Message-ID: >From: Chris Ptacek > Not at all. I think you've misunderstood. What he's saying is >that you claim that it's okay to like DT while everyone likes it, but for Well then I have not misunderstood, he has, because that's definately not what I said :). > The fact that drooling reviews of a band you've heard can turn you >off to something, suggests that you would rather dislike an album for the >sake of being different than listen to it and like or dislike it on the >basis of any merit. If we all say an album sucks, and pick it apart like >vultures, would that make you buy it? Making suggestions about me implies that you are losing sight of the point, but I will answer that. As I've already said, if you are trying to convince someone that a band is good, 15 "OH THEY ROOL" reviews is not the way to do it. If I am interested in a band, I will buy their album to hear it. If it gets picked apart and I hear something that you dislike that I would actually like in a band, I will buy it. But what you think about an album has no relation to whether I will buy it or not. How someone writes about an album (and their follow-ups to opposing viewpoints) will though, since it says a lot about the maturity of the fans of this band or that. > I think it's insulting to say that just because we like something >means that we HAVE to like evrything in that genre. It's possible that we >WILL like it all, but it's not required. I didn't like Mayadome or >Artension at all... You might find it insulting but the truth hurts. If Shadow Gallery puts out another album that is "typical" prog-metal than 90% of people here will love it (while others might very well think it is repulsive and awful). You don't have to like that fact but don't shoot the messenger over it. BTW a Predisposition is exactly that.. not everybody here MUST like EVERY prog metal group, but MOST people here like A LOT/THE MAJORITY of the prog metal they have been exposed here. I'd love to see someone argue this point sucessfully. >> >Sorry for the waste of bandwidth. >> If you were sorry you'd have emailed me instead of spamming to the >> list. > You call him a hypocrite for doing exactly what you did? No. I call him a hypocrite for APOLOGIZING about it. He does it and then apologizes. Well gee, I believe he's REALLY sorry. That's why he did it in the first place? Meanwhile I'm not sorry. I haven't wasted bandwidth here in a long time, so I'll waste all the bandwidth I want if that's how much space I need to make my point. So your supposition is false (I did not do exactly as he did) because we are referring to different events (you to the post, me to the apology for such) and therefore I re-affirm that YES I am calling him a hypocrite. Still going to try and find fault here? > Unless you're me, and DO buy every cd that comes out (and I am NOT >made of money... I just have ridiculous spending habits) then don't be >absurd. You have to pick and choose. You hear a review of a band and >think it may be interesting, you find the album and buy it or check it >out, etc. That's the way it's always worked. Well that's what I've been saying, Chris. And do you find a review that consists entirely of finding different ways of saying just HOW good a new album is interesting? I sure as hell don't. So therefore when it's time to "pick and choose" as you say, I check out other interests, like Mike Oldfield, King Crimson, Ange, iQ, Jethro Tull, etc. It doesn't hurt that in each of these cases, I've found helpful people who gave accurate and objective reviews of their work to help me out. And then you have to contrast that with .. say.. APSoG (just for argument's sake). So I decide not to "choose" Fatez. So then you imply that I am impressionable by groups, or the converse, that I rebel against group thinking to be different and prove that the former is false :). So please, don't make a suggestion for me as above that if followed leads us to the situation here, ie, me not choosing to listen to FATE'S because of the reviews. >> personally. It's not a routine thing for me. If you have never called >> anyone who you disliked a name before, I hereby declare my immaturity. >> Otherwise you will have to retract your attack or you are being a hypocrite. > No. I am not some "Pinnacle of Maturity". And if I, myself, >attack someone on the basis of maturity and then immediately call that >person a name, for lack of argumentative skill, then I am being a >hypocrite. As we are all evolving mentally throughout life, it is >impossible to not be a hypocrite at some time or another. Anyone that >claims no hypocrisy is a liar AND a hypocrite. But I don't think you can >make an argument based on how immature someone is, and then follow it up >with immaturity, without making an ass of yourself. I called Pat a wank because I think he is a wank. If you think that is an immature thing to do then you are standing in judgement of millions of people who think (and say) bad things about other people. That's a heavy burden to bear, but if you think you can do it by all means go ahead. IMHO --> A middle finger raised to someone gratuitously is a different story. The person doing so is doing so for no reason other than that they don't like the opinions expressed in the message. Meanwhile I'm doing it because I've made the judgement decision based on over a year around r.m.a.q., this list, etc. that I don't like Pat. If you can't see the difference you will think I am a hypocrite for calling the finger immature. I can't say anything to that other than that I disagree with your assessment because I think the two cases were different. >> else to hold it and defend that person. Don't you Americans have a first >> amendment about Free Speech? (Or is the 3rd or 5th??) I thought that >> extended to ideas and opinions and expression as well. Maybe I'm >> incorrect. > I'm not "Hitler" and I'm not trying to limit anyone's free >expression. But I am all over anyone's case when I think they are being >disrespectful. Everything is offensive to somebody Chris. That's the world we live in. If everybody jumped all over somebody who they found disrespectful we'd have a flame war every day, in every newsgroup on Usenet and on every mailing list. For example, I found people slagging Rush for not liking the tribute VERY disrespectful. And while I did post a couple of times over it, it never went into a flame war. I know you are a "frequent poster" to the jam but please realize that doesn't give you any extra rights as to deciding when somebody is being disrespectful to somebody else. If everybody here were able to turn their cheek and use discretion we'd have a lot less of this. And yes, I realize that in this case it was largely due to MY lack of discretion among other things, but usually I just ignore such things (like Rush tribute, etc.). If we ALL decided to count to 10 before deciding somebody was disrespectful, none of this would ever happen. Unfortunately that doesn't happen here any more than anywhere else, so you end up with big-ass flame wars, failed DT tributes, failed Yste-Con-Bash-Crash-Summer Thingy, people leaving the list, and the Ystejam being .. well .. very sad as a supposed representation of the average Dream Theater fan who is more concerned about when the new album will come out than in Savatage's reissue, Fatez' album ROOLing or SUKing, the Ozzfest lineup and other things. Gee, this is kind of ballooning. I don't want any hard feelings over this, because the Jam does accomplish a lot (ie, Mike Bahr's CDs, the ACOS mega-single, the petition) but the same energy that gets these good things done often is equally negative (ie in the ways I've outlined above). I have not unsubscribed although I often wonder why, and I think it's mainly due to the positive things that rarely happen here and forgive the rest of it. Somehow I'm not in the mood to fight anymore. -- "To seek the sacred river Alph, and walk the caves of ice..." - Rush "Ashes and Diamonds,Foe and Friend/We were all equal in the end." -Pink Floyd "The sands of time were eroded by the river of constant change." - Genesis "Others steal your thoughts they're not confined within your mind"-DreamTheater ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 2522 **************************