YTSEJAM Digest 1412 Today's Topics: 1) Ytse Sr. Citizen by "mmetzger" 2) Re: Geez... by Benjamin Brizzell 3) Mail Item Format Warning by "RESPONSE at IBMMAIL 04/05/96 - 16:32:46" 4) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1410 by email_address_removed (Larry Odneal) 5) Re Sicko Bass Players by nga@software-ag.de (Neil Gallop) 6) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1411 by email_address_removed (Barb Battaglia) 7) Click tracks and Savatage by email_address_removed (Seth Hatlelid) 8) Neil Gallop's Brain...or lack thereof by Andrew Bunk 9) Re: YTSEJAM digest 1405 by Marc Respass 10) Prog-Metal - No lyrics included by Mike Backof 11) Re: Geez... (NDTC) by Suicyco 12) Yes, I have a guess dammit. by Ben Laussade 13) toast&brains by Mason Pokladnik 14) Norse BM by email_address_removed 15) elders by CLIFF & PAM WHEATON 16) Montiors by email_address_removed 17) Re: ART? by email_address_removed ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 5 Apr 1996 09:57:49 U From: "mmetzger" To: "YTSEJAM" Subject: Ytse Sr. Citizen Message-ID: >> Someone asked who the younger jammers were. Then someone >> complained about all the young jammers. So, who is the oldest >> jammer on the list? It *has* to be that asshole from Oregon. Man, I've heard that that dude is ooooold. Hugh G. Rection ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 10:23:10 -0500 (EST) From: Benjamin Brizzell To: email_address_removed Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Geez... Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Apr 1996, Lars Hellsten wrote: > > Last one I promise. GO OUT AND BUY "ROOTS" BY SEPULTURA! These guys > >get my vote for best metal album of '96! They have been listening to > .. > >style and barks/chants/raps ala Korn with aplomb. Support these > >extremely talented guys! They are touring for the next year and a > >half so be damn sure to go and see them. It's sure to be an > >incredible show! I hope they tour with Korn! Riots would commence at > >the end of every show!!!!!!!!! > > What a pile of bullshit. I used to think the people here had taste in music > (maybe they really did and there's just a lot of newbies on the list), and > that the reason we liked Dream Theater was that the music can be considered > "metal", but is extremely progressive and isn't at all like your typical > metal band. > > Now all of a sudden people on this list are talking about death metal > (please!), Korn (my brother has their CD - you call this MUSIC?!? > TALENTED?!?!? HAHAHAHAHAH! Excuse me, I just pissed myself...) > > Can we please go back to the OLD YtseJam? > Have you ever heard Dark Tranquility, At The Gates, or Death? This is all very technical death metal that I consider to be better music than DT. Does this mean that I have no taste in music, because it doesn't agree with yours? Open you mind... ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Ben Brizzell | "Flee the icy Lucifer. | | e-mail address: | Oh, he's an awful fellow! | | email_address_removed | What a mistake! | | Individual Studies | I didn't take a feather from his pillow." | | Sage Junior College | - JETHRO TULL | | of Albany | "A Passion Play" | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Check out my band, ANACHRONISM's, new home page at | | http://fire.camp.clarkson.edu/~rappazmc/pump.html | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 10:31:27 EST From: "RESPONSE at IBMMAIL 04/05/96 - 16:32:46" To: email_address_removed Subject: Mail Item Format Warning Message-ID: The mail item that you sent at 15:31:20 GMT on 05 Apr 1996 has been delivered. However, it has been necessary to convert this item into a format that is acceptable to the recipient, FITIPMOL at IBMMAIL. Information beyond column 79 in the mail item will have been wrapped. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 07:40:01 -0800 From: email_address_removed (Larry Odneal) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1410 Message-ID: Cory wrote: > by email_address_removed (Sheila Swanson) > So, who is the oldest jammer on the list? I am - after all, I'm fucking ANCIENT! Somebody else wrote: >Does anyone know the results of Wrestlemania XII? Yea, I do, the results are that it sucked, just like all that other phony Wrestling shit that people spend good money on. (IMHO) And another somebody wrote: >from the latest _zia zine_ (an arizona record store): > > blind melon has found a new vocalist: sebastian bachm formerly of >skid row. in related melon news, a final album featuring deadguy >shannon hoon is to be released later this year. it includes tracks >recorded shortly before the singer's untimely death--not from drugs >and alcohol, as previous reports indicated, but from asphyxiation >resulting from looping a necktie over a joist in the tour bus, and >hanging himself while masturbating--as well as "hotel" tapes made by >hoon during the band's tour. in addition, a bootleg video of hoon and >other band members is reportedly circulating amoung tape trading >circles: it depicts the melon guys taking turns hanging with the >necktie while whacking off. > Was this by any chance written by Sloof Lirpa? NO WAY would Sebastian Bach join those lamers! >as for some real dt content, the big station here in the phoenix area, >kupd (97.9), played perfect strangers about 45 minutes ago. > Cool! I still think that "Perfect Strangers" should have been released as a single. It rocks! (Is it too late???) Larry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 96 17:50:33 +0200 From: nga@software-ag.de (Neil Gallop) To: email_address_removed Cc: email_address_removed.de Subject: Re Sicko Bass Players Message-ID: Hi all (again, 2nd time for today) Christopher Merlo wrote "Why are all the sickos bass players?". Well don't forget the daddy of 'em all: Sid Vicious (the Sex Pistols are still one of the best live bands I ever saw - I caught them by chance in Bristol England in 76 when they were touring under the pseudomyn SPOT ). Enough wierd punctuation in that sentence, folks? Hmm, that gives me an idea for my couch potato viewing for this evening: The Great Rock'n'Roll Swindle (with the Sex Pistols) followed by Fritz The Cat (they just happen to be on the same video). Anybody else out there like The Clash? Nostalgia just ain't what is used to be. The second bottle of champagne seems to be working, unlike my fingers. Considering it's Good Friday, perhaps I could also watch The Life Of Brian tonight. Still, always look on the bright side of life (quick quote): Damon Hill (not Fibraio) will give Michael Schumacher another good stuffing in the Argentinian Grand Prix on Sunday. Final score: Williams-Renault 3 Ferrari 0. Drink and work just don't mix (a bit like marriage and sex I suppose). Anyone else out there going/already deaf? Seriously, my ENT specialist told me on Thursday that I can expect to have a hearing aid within the next 4-5 years. I can hardly hear anything about 7 MHz on my right ear, and the limit is not much higher on the left. Might as well enjoy loud music while I can. Damon, we could go to concerts together: I'll tell you what the light show was like, and you can tell me what the band played. nuff said for today stay safe and happy listening Neil Gallop (nga@software-ag.de) Currently playing: Lake of Tears - Headstones ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 11:27:11 -0500 (EST) From: email_address_removed (Barb Battaglia) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1411 Message-ID: >Can we please go back to the OLD YtseJam? Yes. As Dorothy said (clicking her heels) - "There's no place like home. There's no place like home." -BABS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 10:29:10 -0600 From: email_address_removed (Seth Hatlelid) To: email_address_removed Subject: Click tracks and Savatage Message-ID: Hiya, This is to answer the question about the click track. A click track is simply a track that clicks out the tempo like a metronome so that the tempo of the song remains constant, or at least the section of the song to be played at that tempo. Next: I recently purchased Savatage's Dead Winter Dead at a suggestion from the 'jam. I LOVE IT!! Great stuff. I want to get some more of their stuff but I'm kind of worried about anything older than Edge of Thorns. I've heard Jon Oliva "sing" on "I Am" and "Doesn't Matter Anyway". Let me just say that Jon Oliva is to Zackary Stevens what Charles Dominici is To Kevin James LaBrie. Zack's voice is sooooooo much more palatable, at times he sounds very much like Michael Crawford of "Phantom of the Opera" fame while Jon sounds like he's garggling with razor blades and trying to do bad slayer covers. And people seem to think that Zack is inferior to Jon!!!! WHY? The question I'm getting to is: is any Savatage with Jon at the helm worth the $15. The vocalist is pretty important to me, that's one of my major complaint's with I Mother Earth. Anybody have any thoughts? DTC!!!! I know that John P gives guitar lessons (I bet he charges through the nose), but does John Myung teach? I'm a bass player and would love to learn from the 'silent man'. Cheers! email_address_removed Seth Hatlelid "This is true love. Do you think this happens everyday? Death can stop true love, only delay it for a while."-The Princess Bride "As you wish." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 11:00:47 -0600 From: Andrew Bunk To: email_address_removed Subject: Neil Gallop's Brain...or lack thereof Message-ID: Well, I tried to get rid of these jams, but they just keep comin', so I read 'em when I've got absolutely nothing else to do here at work. First off, I'd like to say that I try to not insult people when they display a substantial amount of musical ignorance, but there are exceptions that simply have to be made. Case in point, one Neil Gallop. I'll try to be nice. Well, poor Neil seems to think Jon Anderson puts lyrics together just because of how they sound. (How someone can say this while listening to the sonic manure known as the Smashing Pumpkins is still beyond my human comprehension.) If poor Neil had any kind of culture, he'd know that Tales From Topographic Oceans was based on Jon's strong eastern religious beliefs, and part on certain folklore, I believe. If there were no Yes, Neil, you would have no Dream Theater; at least, not the way they are now. They were the first prog band to perfect the configuration that DT uses. Barring country, rap, and dance music, (and some bottom-of-the-barrel alternative bands), I have just about any kind of music on my CD rack that you could imagine. Saga. John Tesh. Slayer. Alice In Chains. Seal. Edvard Grieg. Etc. So it really burns me when people don't think before they speak (or write). I'm not an old fogey bitching about how people should respect the elder prog bands. I'm only 21, and most of the pioneering prog-rock came out while I was still a sparkle in my daddy's eye. Next time you think you need to say something negative about a band, use that brain (where applicable) to think of something else good to say about a band you do like. Because the simple truth of the matter is, NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT WHAT YOU DON'T LIKE. If you need some attention, get a dog. If you're nice to it, maybe it will lick you. That is all. BROUGHT TO YOU BY THE FOUNDATION TO END MUSICAL IGNORANCE ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:40:08 -0500 From: Marc Respass To: Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 1405 Message-ID: > But this is only true for music which is art: and, in my > opinion, only classical music is art: so, a classical > musician and mainly a classical composer are artists: the > others are not. (So, DT's music is not a form of art... do > you agree?) I would have to give that a big NO! My goodness. Only western classical music is art now? ---------- > HELL I Could record The sounds my ASS makes when I take a > Dump and Call it Music. Then i too would be a musician... Except that you'd be wrong. I could make a chair and call it a table. Would it be a table? No. --Marc Respass (email_address_removed) Come visit the Joel Rivard Group home page at http://www.tiac.net/users/marcr/ [ we like to thing our music is art anyway ] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 12:54:45 -0800 From: Mike Backof To: email_address_removed Subject: Prog-Metal - No lyrics included Message-ID: Hello Jammers, Someone asked about prog-metal bands with no lyrics. Generally the prog bands without lyrics are going to be towards the jazz/fusion end of the genre, there are a few bands that might appeal to jammers. Fourth Estate - "See What I See" This band is an all instrumental combination of Kings X and the Steve Morse Band/ Dixie Dregs. They are a trio, incredible musicianship all around, no lyrics included. See my Unsigned Bands page for information on ordering. (URL is in my .sig) Boud Deun - "Fiction and Several Days" Another all instrumental band similar to Mahavishnu Orchestra/ John McLaughlin with a bit of funk bass thrown in on top. Instrumentally they are violin, bass, guitar, drums. Lots of killer instrumental work, fast and furious, I've seen them live five times and talked to the band members on numerous occations (at other concerts, etc..) they play music from any genre and can mix it together, (sorta like Phish does, except at a higher speed). They've played Heart of the Sunrise by Yes, some AC/DC, and they jam frequently live. They have a listing on my Unsigned Bands page, or you can e-mail email_address_removed to find out an address to send the money and Shawn will get you a CD in the mail. Djam Karat - "Burning the Hard City", "Reflections From the Firepool" This all instrumental band from California mixed multiple guitar soloists, drums, bass / keyboardist and their music on both of these CDs goes from solo into solo, building and recessing, really great stuff. email_address_removed can get you their CDs. Ozric Tentacles - "Erpland", "Live Underslunky", "Arborescence" Another mostly instrumental band (they have voices on a couple of tunes) they mix metal/rock with psychedelic effects and furious bass playing. "Live Underslunky" is their heaviest album and IMO one of their best, "Erpland" is their best studio effort. "Arborescence" is also a good studio album, and it is the only one of the three you can get domestically in the USA, Columbia House even carries it for those who don't want to spend a lot of money, and check out this band. Later, Mike ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Backof email_address_removed http://www.gl.umbc.edu/~mbacko1 WWW Pages - Unsigned Bands: http://www.gl.umbc.edu/~mbacko1/munsign.html WWW Pages - Inferno Page: http://www.gl.umbc.edu/~mbacko1/inferno.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 14:14:24 -0500 From: Suicyco To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: Geez... (NDTC) Message-ID: If you hadn't figured out by now, a lot of people on this list like metal, thrash, whatever you want to call it. Everyone I have met on this list or likes DT is into metal or at one time was. Personally DT is the lightest group I listen to next to Diamond Head and Metallica. Granted Korn does suck, I saw them live, but Sepultura rules, especially live. Just because someone doesn't like, well, whatever type of music you like doesn't mean they deserved to be flammed. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:35:12 -0700 From: Ben Laussade To: email_address_removed Subject: Yes, I have a guess dammit. Message-ID: Yo. >Hey everybody... let's play a new game! let's play the >'guess-what-they're-playing-in-the-Awake-picture' game... any guesses? Caught in a Web. James is holding a tambourine. >Nor do I feel that someone who buys a set of drums and sits on a street >corner banging away, begging for spare change a musician. You must always >be learning. , always increasing your knowledge of the instrument, beyond >simply playing. The moment you say "I know enough, let's just play for the >rest of my life" you cease to be a true musician. I digress. I learn by playing. I sit and play and fool around, and I'll think up something new...that's learning, isn't it? I'll practice something until I get it down (or go hurt something because it's frustrating). After I'm drumming, I kind of judge how good that "session" was based on how much new stuff I pounded out. >But of course, this is only my opinion: I could be wrong. Yes, you are wrong. That is NOT your opinion. thisisasmiley >Currently playing: Smashing Pumpkins - Pisces Iscariot You want fries with that? >Now all of a sudden people on this list are talking about death metal >(please!), Korn (my brother has their CD - you call this MUSIC?!? >TALENTED?!?!? HAHAHAHAHAH! Excuse me, I just pissed myself...) > >Can we please go back to the OLD YtseJam? /me drags Lars out from under the rock he's used for a hiding spot for the last few months. First of all, that wasn't the first time death metal has been talked about on the Jam. Second of all, your post isn't going to change anyone's mind. Just says that you don't respect other people's opinions. And with the "You call this MUSIC?!?!" line.....let's not start that thread again. :-) >Can we please go back to the OLD YtseJam? > No. The Ytsejam is progressive. We constantly change. You cannot defeat us. thisisasmiley Toodles! Mr. Cool ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 13:41:07 -0600 (CST) From: Mason Pokladnik To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: toast&brains Message-ID: well My high school history teacher once gave us a recipe book they made in the 40's during WWII. It included all sorts of interesting recipes including one for "creamed brains on toast." ------------------------------------ -Mason Pokladnik - email_address_removed - -http://http.tamu.edu:8000/~fmp8157- ------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 15:36:44 EST From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Norse BM Message-ID: --- Saapunut 03.MAPE 90-4694432 05-04-96 23.38 -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET IBM IMX Hello all. With all the questions and unbelievable stories about Norwegian black metal going around, I think I'll mix my spoon to this soup also. For the ones who asked how is the music in general, the answer is that it's mostly just mindless rant and rave. Nothing more. There are EXCEPTIONS tho'. For the sake of telling some rad story of the movement (these seem to be the ones ppl like to hear) I can tell that the guy who is a band called BURZUM serves 22 years in the penitentiary of Trondheim for murder one. He killed the bassist of another black metal band (with his bare fists) because the guy attempted to kill him first. Oh man. There's absolutely nothing to look up on in these morons. If you're gonna buy CDs because they're rad, get a grip. One of these exceptions is the band ULVER. Btw. that's wolves in English. I just purchased two of their albums and they are able to show that there can be more to black metal than just bashing away. Their album BERGTATT should give a major kick to the ones who dig old Metallica. There's some really innovative ideas in the music and the CD creates the atmosphere of the wild Norse nature; you feel like enjoying the Norwegian Lappland's silent darkness in the darkest of winters and the next thing you know you're being kicked in the butt. The second album I bought is Kveldssanger (Night Songs, if I get my Norwegian right). Now everyone who likes atmospheric music, be sure to get this one. Imagine the feeling you get when you sit on a high cliff, looking down to a frozen lake, everything so peaceful, so solemn and you, so lonely. The sun is setting and you get the feeling that for once in your lifetime you are one with the barren nature of the north. That's the feeling I get listening this disc. It's all acoustic, almost no lyrics at all and it has to be the most beautiful thing I've heard in a long, long time. So if anyone of you is going to buy an album of the black metal genre, just be sure it's from Ulver. The rest I've heard is shit. _Mape_ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 96 13:42 MST From: CLIFF & PAM WHEATON To: email_address_removed Subject: elders Message-ID: >Someone asked who the younger jammers were. Then someone complained about >all the young jammers. So, who is the oldest jammer on the list? I'm 34. anyone else care to jump in on this? >And YKYARDTF(tm) Hey Zach-I think I started that one- but I don't care-it's fun to play with. DTC: my current favorite song: Voices. yes folks, I finally found Mike Bahr's page-and the info about his different CD's-so I won't be asking stupid questions on the 'jam again. Nice, huh? (sarcasm) c-ya!! Have a happy Easter!! Keep Rockin' Pam ___/----^--\____ < /__rockin' cabbie_\o 0 0 TAKING THE ROAD TO ADVENTURE (Pam) email_address_removed (http:/netnow.micron.net/~cwheaton) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 14:56:35 -0600 (CST) From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Montiors Message-ID: Date sent: 5-APR-1996 14:50:21 Ernie posted raising some questions about recording. Yes, the things on the floor are monitors. However, I can almost guarantee that that photo was for show and they weren't recording at the time it was taken. If you notice, everyone appears to be in the same room. You wouldn't want that. You'd get too much bleedthrough among tracks, which would make mixdown hell. I believe "click track" was already defined. It's MIDI-generated, and would come from an external source unless the board would have a built-in metronome. We don't know if they were recording to a click track. We weren't there. ________________________________________________________________________________ Debbie Seeger University of Wisconsin-Oshkosh email_address_removed Music Major (Recording Technology Emphasis) "People are kind of like rubber band balls. You take off one layer and you have another one to take off until you hit some rotten rubber band and decide it's not worth taking the bands off." -Billie Jo Brom ________________________________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Apr 96 15:54:58 PST From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: ART? Message-ID: I should probably let this thread die a well deserved death, but... >>But this is only true for music which is art: and, in my opinion, only >classical >>music is art: so, a classical musician and mainly a classical composer are >>artists: the others are not. I thought only progressive musicians were allowed to be pretentious? >Art is very difficult to define, but I don't think that something beautiful, >elaborated, original, intelligent, must be necessarily defined art. Why not? Why must everybody place rules and restrictions on everything? Art and creativity are some of the things that elevate us above some kind of instinct driven hunter / gatherer. We "create" things for no other reason than to please ourselves (and hopefully others). Why should there be any limit to what one individual perceives as "art"? The perception of what is and what is not art is as individualistic as you can get. >An artist, to produce a work of art, must have a great knowledge of art >history, and must be able to understand and reproduce the art of the past. Then >he can move one step forward, being original but at the same time bearing in >mind the rules of what he's doing, maybe partially breaking some of them. I fail to see the logic in this statement. I am sure that there are plenty of people that many would call artists, who can not reproduce the work of their peers and are probably not inclined to do so. Sure most artists start out with an appreciation for their chosen art, but the strive for creativity will push them to create from within themselves and not merely become proficient at copying the works of others. Knowledge of what other artists do and why they do it can be very helpful, but it is definately not a requirement. >The point is, I think rock music partially had classical music as an influence, >but I refuse to call it art. It's a popular form of music that is done for >easy pleasure, not as an artistic purpouse. I think somebody like Frank Zappa would have you for lunch over a blanket statement like that. Who says that a rock band can't make music purely for artistic purposes? And who says that a classical composer won't just do it for the money? I think that any style of music is an art form, each individual will then perceive some of it as art and some as noise... >Progressive rock originates from rock. Of course, it is much more closer to >art then others genres. How much closer? So does that mean that really progressive jazz/fusion is EVEN closer? >But it belongs to another field, and it is completely separated from modern >classical music. Not completely separated, but merely presented in a different style. Some would even argue that progressive artists of the 70s WERE the modern classical composers... >But don't get me wrong: it's just a matter of definition. I don't listen to >modern classical music, while I love DT. I also listen to easier music, for >example Pearl Jam, because I like it. But they aren't art. I never did understand this wanting to label things hard/easy... What the hell is "easy listening" music? Music that won't ask you to solve word problems? BTW, I like Pearl Jam too, but I DO consider them artists... Well, I think that is enough rambling on this subject.... 8^) /~~~~~~~ Michael Kizer -- Computer Sciences Corporation (Tucson, AZ) ~~~~~~~\ \ Email: email_address_removed (preferred) -or- email_address_removed / / WWW: http://www.indirect.com/www/mkizer \ \ ^---> Check here for the Dream Theater Song Book... / / "Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose." - Rush (The Band!) \ \______________________________________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 1412 **************************