YTSEJAM Digest 1245 Today's Topics: 1) Re: The NAMM Show by Walter S Semerenko 2) Re: The NAMM show, JP, etc. by email_address_removed (Zack Gemmill) 3) Re: ACOS Live - The "Outro" by email_address_removed (DUSTY VESTAL) 4) Metalheads by Dark Tower 5) LaBrie "debate" by Martin Spain 6) to Matt by Joseph Dunn 7) Heh heh.... by Ben Laussade 8) Another Mr Serious Response by email_address_removed (Rahiel Elaine Housey) 9) An open letter to Mr. Serious by Greg Picklesimer 10) Current CD UPDATE!! by Michael Bahr 11) "Lie" CD single for sale by email_address_removed 12) WDATU!!!!!! by "Daniel James Temmesfeld" 13) WDATU quick review by Partha Mukhopadhyay 14) WDATU and stuff by BILL HUSTON 15) Hello as =?ISO-8859-1?Q?well=A8?= by email_address_removed.se 16) DT DOOM2 = COMPLETE!! by Dave 17) ACOS Outro and music degrees by email_address_removed (Marc Respass) 18) Derek Sherinian Interview by email_address_removed (Michael Bradley) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 28 Jan 1996 20:43:19 -0500 (EST) From: Walter S Semerenko To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: The NAMM Show Message-ID: On Sun, 28 Jan 1996 ytsejam@arastar.com wrote: > Date: Mon, 22 Jan 1996 20:33:21 -0500 (EST) > From: Brian Wherry > > (BTW - he attracted quite a huge crowd -- much bigger than when Blues > Saraceno played at the Lexicon booth the day before!) After that (and a Cool! Blues Saraceno was there? I'm glad that he got some attention; he's highly underrated or maybe that's highly unpopular. Could you give me more info what happened? Marc Bonilla. (sorry Patricia) Awww...shucks. I just got his latest album and I'm starting to like this guy. Any other instrumental guitarists that you saw and any info on them? Thanks, Walter. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Jan 96 18:55:45 PST From: email_address_removed (Zack Gemmill) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: The NAMM show, JP, etc. Message-ID: <9601290255.AA14507@tengs1> I was wondering when somebody was going to mention the show. My friend Cassandra (sometimes fleeting) drove down from Sacramento for it. She called me and said that she talked to both John and Mike (she said they were very cool). Mike even remembered her and I from the Fates Warning bus in SFO from the Awake tour. She told him that I had flown out from CA to see the LI show and he said that the show was very good (like he's going to say it sucked!). It didn't even occur to me to have her ask some questions because it didn't occur to me that anyone from DT was going to be there, oh well. Concerning meeting band members, they probably do like it that you talk about personal stuff. She was talking to JP about his kids and stuff, and he probably appreciated it a lot. 'jam on, Zach ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Jan 1996 18:26:21 -0700 From: email_address_removed (DUSTY VESTAL) To: email_address_removed Subject: Re: ACOS Live - The "Outro" Message-ID: [OK Folks, this thread is also now dead. Anything more concerning the Mr Serious thread that I receive after this batch will be returned. It may seem like an OD, but I've put all of the Mr Serious stuff together here to get it flushed out of the queue. If you're planning on just skipping this thread, note the last one (with the subject of "An Open Letter to Mr. Serious")--kbibb] Mr. Serious, I appreciate your critique of James voice, but this is still rock and roll we're dealing with. I'll admit that I do not have your credentials behind me....but I have dealt with alot of musicians in my life and know a few things about what singers have to deal with in a live situation. Any classically trained tenor who is truly in love with his voice tends to steer clear of rock. In live situations, rock singers are forced to deal with an extremely difficult sound environment. On stage sound monitors can only go so far in clearing up the sound environment. Rock musicians are forced to deal with odd echo effects from the PA reverberating through the hall, the screaming of fans, their own sound monitors screwing up, the strain of performing on a nightly basis...and a thousand other extraneous problems. In other words, comparing singers from operatic or even Broadway musical backgrounds to rock (especially prog rock and/or heavy metal) singers is more than a little bit like comparing apples to oranges. True, classical training can help overcome some of the problems...but even those who do have classical training (such as Geoff Tate) tend to have alot of problems during tours. Also...as a fan I feel that sometimes classical training can rob a voice of its honesty and its originality. You might not agree with that....it's my own opinion, and we are each entitled to our own opinions. I am just sick of James bashing. As to his "greatness"....I would really be interested in knowing who YOU are comparing him to. I think that his voice enhances Dream Theater's prescence...on stage as well as in the studio. I do hope that as a musician, he continues to work on his craft. But I would expect thatout of anyone. Mellow Metal Musings, The Cat [sig trimmed] |"Likely or not, it's a dream that we keep and at odds with| | our senses we'll climb. But if faith is the answer, we've| | already reached it, and if spirit's a sign, then it's | | only a matter of time" ---- DREAM THEATER | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 07:14:24 -0800 (PST) From: Dark Tower To: email_address_removed Subject: Metalheads Message-ID: This was a funny post. There is nothing so comical as one who starts by holding himself up to put others down. It's been addressed that James did study classical voice for over four years, I am another who knows this is true. Further, if this fellow knows his theory and music history, he knows that classical musical scores for the voice were written so as not to over-tax the range of the vocalist. In any one evening, Pavorotti, Domingo, Carreras, will only hit seven or so high "C"'s. The classical composers were aware that these tenors they were writing for would not well sustain an entire opera singing at the edge of their vocal limits. Also, the language has distincitve advantages, too. Italian opera, which comprises a large portion of the entire opera opus, uses a very limited interpretation of the vowel sounds. What this means is that it lends itself to voice preservation, and reduces dramatically the singing of open vowels which stress the vocal bands. Seth Riggs, out of L.A., one of the leading vocal trainers - if you know him, you know what I mean - makes a living showing singers how to close down their vowels to preserve their careers. Most opera pronunciation does also borrow from the Italian for it's vowel carriage. And what of the business of not being perfect live. Honestly, it is part and parcel to the experience of live music. Pavorotti broke on high "C" the other day, don't you know. I guess I'm more forgiving, I see music as a process, not a result. I understand the comment about diction, James does elect to compromise the vowel at times in favor of a fuller, "larger" sounding vowel, noteably the long "a" vowel sound in place of long "e" vowel sounds, but this, in my opinion, is done deliberately to project the note, which carries a sense of flight for me, and is also a stylistic choice. Let us not forget, too, that he is not on stage at the Met. Rock music is a separate medium, and demands and deserves its own unique identity. Neither am I a metalhead. I am certain their are metalheads who read the jam. But how does anyone presume to sterotype? Perhaps, I had taken for granted that almost by virtue of the music itself, a DT listener would inherently be less prone to pigeonhole someone based on generalizations. It occurs to me that generalizations are the refuge of a simple mind. If you knew me, anyway, if, say, you saw my CD collection, you would reexamine that particular statement. I am decidedly not a metalhead. DT is heavy at times, but I find their "darker" sections serve a compositional purpose, not heavy guitar for it's own sake. Else, I'd have a harder time reconciling myself to these passages. Yes, I like James very much. But after all this, I guess, maybe I don't feel as if he needs any defense from the comments of the likes of "Mr. Serious." Peter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 1996 18:23:31 +0000 (GMT) From: Martin Spain To: Ytsejam Subject: LaBrie "debate" Message-ID: Mr. Serious, Charone Frankel said it all. You're a fool if you think that a Master's Degree gives you the right to insult another's talent. Can you sing like James LaBrie? Thought not. Learn some respect, guy. Mart ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 1996 13:27:55 -0800 (PST) From: Joseph Dunn To: Ytse Jam Subject: to Matt Message-ID: I was just reading a jam from about 3 posts ago..some guy was ragging on Mr. Serious about using a condecending attitude against the 'musically uneducated'...I think his name was Matt..anyway...Mat said something about being able to enjoy music without understanding it just feeling the emotion that comes off of it...I agree with you to a point. I am a music major at CSU Stanislaus..performance..I am a freshman so I haven't had 'extensive' training and I hold no degree so...I've liked DT and music in general for several years now..like since birth..up until about three years ago I didn't really know what was happening in music or the actual why things happened..kinda like someone in a math class who never did the proofs..they'd just take the formula and figure it out...you got there but you didn't get to see how it was formulated..how neat some little intrcacies were...Having a semester of actual theory and jazz arranging has helped me a lot..I am a drummer but now I am understaning chord structures, form, analization of movements etc..it brings a whole new excitment to a piece..you know what I mean? You come to a new level of understanding...you don't lose those carnal 'willies' from the emotion of a piece, you have that and more..you retain everything and gain so much..that's where a lot of 'educated' musicians piss a lot of people off..they think they know everything and they are hotshots..well, one of my friends, Jimbo is the most incredible bass player I have ever seen...he has no understanding of actual theory or arranging..he just plays..the guy has the most incredible ear on the planet! He learned the whole I&W album after two days of listening! The guy has more chops than John Pattituci himself or Myung...(by far) he's not educated but still an incredible musician...but he cannot read..it is painstaking to get him to read a chart..hmm to make things short..educate yourself..it does no harm..I am scared to think of what my friend is capable of. The music community would tremble..later Joey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 15:42:08 -0700 From: Ben Laussade To: email_address_removed Subject: Heh heh.... Message-ID: I can just see Buck at a Pantera concert.... [Buck peers at Dimebag Darrell's guitar through his trusty binoculars. Darrell is playing the best and most energetic guitar solo ever...moshers are going crazy] BUCK: Hmmm....he needs to arch his fingers just a liiittle more. MOSHER: AGhghahhghahghahg..KILL KILL DIE DIE!!!.... BUCK: You can't kill me...I have a Master's Degree in Music! [Buck pulls it out of his pocket] MOSHER: Yeah...but why are you sitting down in the middle of a moshpit with a pad of paper and a desklamp? BUCK: So I can tediously evaluate the performance, and prove that I am better than them...did I mention that I have a Master's Degree in Music? [Mosher takes the Degree and eats it] MOSHER: No...can I see it? BUCK: I SAID, I HAVE A MASTER'S DEGREE IN MU-AGHAGHGHh!!!!!! [Mosher eats Buck] The moral of this story is, just because you have a Master's Degree in Music doesn't mean that all of your "beliefs" are correct. It also doesn't mean that you taste bad...you are still vulnerable to hungry moshers. :-) BUT... Before the metalhead statement, Buck said "It is my belief", so I'll forgive him for that... But the disliking of subtleties because we're too moronic to understand them WAS...SOOOOOO...WROOOONG!!!!!!!!!!! That's the hugest difference between DT (well, prog in general) and other people! If we wanted it SIMPLE, we'd listen to alternative music. You made it sound like you thought that we were all blithering idiots who didn't care about music and were all jumping on the bandwagon marked "Dream Theater Fans!". In case you're not too bright, DT ain't no bandwagon band. The only way you COULD like them is if you cared about music. Not _technical_ music, but being able to appreciate the BEAUTY and EMOTION of it. SO THERE....MY DAD CAN BEAT UP YOUR DAD! HA! Bafu who? That "Ben Laussade" Guy...what's his problem, anyways? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 18:26:43 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Rahiel Elaine Housey) To: email_address_removed Subject: Another Mr Serious Response Message-ID: Dear YtseJammers In response to the guy who was all bent out of shape about YtseJammers really being JUST metalheaders and all kinds of other stuff: HEY! Yeah, so what if we are metal heads? Some ppl are capable of liking Variety (it is the spice of life, you know). I happen to like just about all kinds of music, much of which is not made by paid professionals, persons holding music degrees, or can even read music! That doesn't make it not music! So, we can all like what we like, and rest assured that we at least all like DT! Yeah! :-) Rahiel -- "If I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know" -Kansas ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 96 7:13:23 MST From: Greg Picklesimer To: email_address_removed Subject: An open letter to Mr. Serious Message-ID: [As mentioned earlier, this is the last post on the Mr Serious thread which will be accepted--kbibb] Dear Dr. Serious, Hopefully, I am not too premature in using the honorarium "Dr", as I am sure such an eminent musicologist as yourself will soon complete the next stage of your education. Allow me to congratulate you on behalf of all the ytsejammers. I am certain these credentials are very useful at the cocktail parties of the rich and famous and in your chosen profession as a doughnut baker. I too carry a strong set of music related credentials, which no doubt will impress you. I have completed two arduous courses in music appreciation, as well as one course in music theory. I have played the guitar for over 25 years, during which time I have taken lessons from some of the most preeminent instructors that Dayton, Ohio has to offer. I am pleased to say that I have progressed to the point that I am now able to "strum chords" and can play songs by Green Day. I have also spent countless hours listening to the masters of classical and popular music, including such great talents as Burl Ives, Wayne Newton and the incomparable Michael Bolton. In addition, I have attended dozens of concerts (or so I have been told), some of which I can actually recall. Obviously, these credentials speak for themselves. I must say that I admire the fortitude it takes to flaunt your credentials before a rabid group of metalheads, such as the members of this group, without regard for potential pain and embarrassment that the ensuing flame war from the lesser educated that would surely result. You have provided me with the inspiration to step forward and do the same. Surely now that our impeccable credentials stand revealed to these cretins, our words will help them to gain a greater understanding of the beauty and subtlety of music like The Ohio Players and the Average White Band, rather than this technically masterful, but emotionally void and sterile excuse for music presented by Dream Theater. Yours in gratitude, Fellow Musicologist, Greg Picklesimer ------------------------------------------------------------------ Greg Picklesimer (email_address_removed) Symbios Logic Inc Fax: (719)573-3824 1635 Aeroplaza Dr. Colorado Springs CO 80916 Phone:(719)573-3497 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 22:51:46 -0700 (MST) From: Michael Bahr To: email_address_removed Subject: Current CD UPDATE!! Message-ID: I've sent a current CD update to Ken and to Jeff for the web page, it's current to today. I'm putting together the Antiquities list this week.. expect it soon. :) Shipments are DEEP DEEP into it for WDATU, I'm really cranking these things out... I'm glad to hear many people are finally getting their discs! Thanks to everyone for their support! Mike Bahr, email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 96 15:17:00 EST From: email_address_removed To: email_address_removed Subject: "Lie" CD single for sale Message-ID: [The following is a merge between Andy's two posts--kbibb] I have an import (Germany) CD single of "The Silent Man" for sale. The first $10 takes it. It also has "Take The Time" (demo) and "Eve". If you are interested, E-mail me at: email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 08:46:00 -500 (EST) From: "Daniel James Temmesfeld" To: email_address_removed Subject: WDATU!!!!!! Message-ID: Mike, you rock!!! I got my WDATU (#26, btw) on Friday. It is awesome!! I'd gotten SUBCON, however I missed AD. WDATU blows SUBCON out of the water. Great cover (and liner notes). I'm one who actually like the original WDADU, I've gotten over CD's vocals. But it's nice to hear KJ on these old songs. I'd heard him do some of 'em from LiT and LatM, but I'd never heard him do Afterlife, SS, TWTHTSTS, OAMOT, etc. I love it. It's also great to hear some of the instrumental parts, like, March of the Tyrant and Showdown, which I'd never heard before... Thanks to Mike for a great CD... Too bad it might get shelfed for a while, because the Galactic Cowboy's Machine Fish comes out tomorrow!!! Dan Temmesfeld email_address_removed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 09:03:57 -0500 (EST) From: Partha Mukhopadhyay To: email_address_removed Subject: WDATU quick review Message-ID: Ok, just my favorites... OaMoT is Phreaking kewl, especially the way it segues into MotT Get Funky/Status Seeker--hey, I like this song, what can I say? Too bad about TOWHtSTS, but ya gotta admit that the distorted opening sounds really menacing..... Once again, THANKS Mike, what can I say? (About those Magic Cards--what the #$%^?) A funny thing happened Friday, I was in this used record store, and found WDADU, so naturally I grabbed it (something about rather having an original edition than a re-release)....then I went home, and checked the mail: WDATU! All in all, a rather good day :) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 07:35:15 -0700 From: BILL HUSTON To: email_address_removed Subject: WDATU and stuff Message-ID: HI all, I received WDATU Saturday (#066). Again, this is a must have. I especially thank Mike Bahr for including TLF on this. I believe this is my favorite song of theirs. The artwork is even better than AD. Some of the songs are not mixed as well as others but their is an explanation included why. If you haven't ordered this yet do so, it is mandatory DT. Some of the versions are much better than WDADU vocal wise-but you expected that, particularly KH. Great stuff, Mike. Wilmo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 16:07:22 +0100 From: email_address_removed.se To: email_address_removed Subject: Hello as =?ISO-8859-1?Q?well=A8?= Message-ID: Hello=A8, A few issues ago, Baron Sangir mentioned about not having Internet access for a month, well, not to out-do him ;-), I 've had no access to Ytsejam since graduating in June 1993=A8. Since being kicked out into the 'real-world' of responsiblities, rat-race, job-market etc, I now have access at last since joining a new company. Since June 1993, I've been fortunate enough to be at DT's show at Ronnie Scott's back in Jan 1995, and to see them at the London Forum in March during their 'Awake' tour. ACOS is brilliant - with the main track (especially the last 11mins or so) and the Elton John cover being my favourites. My other progressives have included Fates Warning - Inside-Out - a bit too sombre and unfortunately does not do justice to their great play at the Forum supporting DT. Magellan is enjoyable - have they brought out anything lately. Also I tried Leviathan - they are ok but a bit too raw-sounding for me. And lastly I've got Yes- Talk,and Big Generator - Talk is played regularly, and Big Generator has its interesting moments. I would recommend subscribing to the DT fanzine run by Neil Elliot. It's well written and produced and there is a real community 'feel' of appreciaton of DT's music. Lastly, does anybody know where in the UK I can actually get a DT T-shirt, posters etc? Thanks for reading=A8 Ashley Wong ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 10:32:20 -0500 From: Dave To: email_address_removed Subject: DT DOOM2 = COMPLETE!! Message-ID: OK EVERYONE who requested the DT doom2 level, it should be in your mailbox...if you requested the level but did not recieve it yet, wait a day then email me again with a request. Here are some important things to remember: The command line to run the level is this: DOOM2 -FILE DT.WAD I recommend trying this one first: DOOM2 -FILE NOMONSTERS -FILE DT.WAD so that you can explore without being crushed by monsters. You could also use the cheat code IDDQD to become invincible. Make sure you find the SPIDER ROOM!! You MUST go check out the spider:) Also, the YTSEJAM symbol in the pit is actually a lift..hit it with your spacebar if you get stuck down in there. I never make pits that you can't get out of! There is a blue skull key in the level somewhere, which will allow you to open the locked door to the exit. Some of the sounds you may not here unless you're in deathmatch, but for the most part this level reeks of DREAM THEATER everywhere!!!!! I hope you all really enjoy this, cuz I busted my ass to make it!:) If you have a web page and want to put this on it available for upload, you may do as long as I am credited for it in the HTML as - Dave Hatlee (email_address_removed) ENJOY!! Dave ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 10:39:13 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Marc Respass) To: email_address_removed Subject: ACOS Outro and music degrees Message-ID: I'd like to comment on the ACOS Outro debate. Some may think that a different version live would be better but I don't understand that. To me, it would be no different than if it was played on the radio and the DJ started talking over the end then cut it off early because he didn't think it fit and it needed a "kick-ass" ending. I mean, the song is the song. If you don't like the end, fine. But if you do like the end, why change it? I can't imagine DT changing the ending. If I wrote and ending on a song and played it live, I'd play the ending too. > honest question: do any of the members of dt have actual > degrees in music? i know they went to berklee, but JP left > after a year. what about the others? and how about miles > davis, george winston, and joe satriani? do they have > degrees? i'm suddenly very curious. Ya' know, I don't think Mile nor Satriani have degrees although they both studied and awful lot. As for G. Winston, I'll keep my opinions to myself. FWIW, Hendrix couldn't read music. A degree may or may not matter. If you go to Berklee (at least, 5 years ago), your degree doesn't mean anything because you could've gotten all A's but had the easy teachers (who you pick and are known) and slid though. OTOH, you may have gotten B's and C's and know a ton and that degree really means something. I suspect that other schools are similar. I don't remember what the masters in music guy said and don't care. A piece of paper is a piece of paper. Some people like that piece of paper and are willing to offer you a job and/or pay you more money because you have it. Sometimes it's worth it, sometimes it isn't. Lot's of famous and not-so-famous, knowledgable musicians do not have degrees. As was pointed out, Petrucci doesn't have one. I wonder if anyone in DT has one. I don't really think it matters. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 12:58:23 -0500 From: email_address_removed (Michael Bradley) To: email_address_removed Subject: Derek Sherinian Interview Message-ID: Hey guys! There has been some interest in the Derek Sherinian interview I quoted a few jams back, so here's what I'll do. When I get some spare time, I'll transcribe the whole thing and send it to anyone interested via e-mail. This will save a lot of band-width. About Derek and the new Korg Prophecy, it's a funny situation. In the interview, he says how psyched he is to use the Prophecy, but at the December shows, I didn't see him use his Prophecy once! It looks cool up on stage, though:) However, he did use the new Korg Trinity a lot, and turned to that when Mike sprayed one of his other keyboards with water. So...e-mail me if you're interested in the interview. I'll send them out when I've transcribed it. Later all! -Mike Bradley ------------------------------ End of YTSEJAM Digest 1245 **************************